[@OKFNau] speaking of values...

Mon Mar 23 02:59:57 UTC 2015

Hi Paul,
  Yeah, it's a good idea, and hard to maintain of course. And hard to
define what is "an OKFNau project". At the very least we could point to a
few starting places to look, like the Github repo (https://github.com/okfnau),
Meetup etc.

Perhaps if we get better at blogging, then that can also start to fill the
void.

Steve

On Sun, Mar 22, 2015 at 4:25 PM, Paul Walsh <paulywalsh at gmail.com> wrote:

> Hi Steve,
>
> Thanks for the links.
>
> I saw Open Council Data mentioned earlier in this thread, and had a look
> on github. This is right up my alley in terms of interests and projects I'm
> working on at present. I'll open an issue on github to talk about that with
> you.
>
> I'll note in the context of this discussion that it would be great to be
> able to discover projects and initiatives like this, and people involved in
> them, right from the home page of OKFNau: the site tells the visitor about
> ambassadors and the advisory board, but doesn't highlight projects, nor
> give any idea of who is working on what. Perhaps an au take on
> okfnlabs.org, or just a simple projects page with links to code, data,
> and maintainers would be useful?
>
> Paul
>
> On 21 Mar 2015, at 14:52, Steve Bennett <stevage at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Hi everyone,
>   I'm an OK ambassador in Melbourne. Thanks for the criticisms - anyone
> who has volunteered or worked in an organisation like this will probably
> know the challenge in constantly keeping the world updated on what you're
> up to. It's also really hard to get a sense of how well informed the
> broader community. Anyway, don't wait for 1-2 years next time to ask what's
> going on - chime in earlier! :)
>
> Anyway, as far as Melbourne goes, most of the current activity is based
> around weekly meetups taking place at ThoughtWorks. These have ramped up a
> lot this year, largely due to the efforts of Lachlan Musicman, Matt Cengia,
> and Fiona Tweedie. We're getting a solid 20-30 people each night.
> www.meetup.com/Open-Knowledge-Melbourne/
>
> We're making a concerted effort to blog every meetup on the OKFN AU blog:
> http://au.okfn.org/blog/
>
> We also post a fair amount to Twitter:
> https://twitter.com/okfnau
>
> One of the big activities I'm personally involved in at the moment is
> http://opencouncildata.org
> (Assistance welcome!)
>
> I've blogged a lot of stuff I've done in the last few months at
> http://melbdataguru.tumblr.com
>
> I'm currently working with VicRoads and Geelong on releasing certain
> datasets, but it's probably not fair on them to talk about it too publicly
> in case there's a last minute hitch.
>
> Steve
>
> On Fri, Mar 20, 2015 at 10:48 PM, Paul Walsh <paulywalsh at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Hi,
>>
>> I just want to back what Cobi has said here:
>>
>> I’ve been on this list (and some other Australian open data lists) for
>> the last 1-2 years. From the outside, it simply looks like next to nothing
>> is happening at okfnau. I’d really like to get more involved but lists like
>> this and Open Australia are relatively inactive most of the time: I can see
>> why Cobi created the pad on the main OK site in order to share some info.
>>
>> I’m an Australian but I’ve been living out of Australia for 10 years:
>> I’ve been working on a number of open data/open gov projects in the last 3
>> years, including Open Knowledge projects (I’m currently a full-time
>> contractor with OK, and I maintain the Open Data Index, as well as work on
>> other projects).
>>
>> Another point: I never see mention of new OK projects on this list - and
>> there is a lot happening in terms of data tooling and open standards for
>> data!
>>
>> Botton line: I’d love to be more involved, and I guess for me, that would
>> mean seeing more of what is actually happening in OKFNau (more writeups on
>> meetings, plans), as well as more specifically, engaging with people who
>> want to start specific initiatives.
>>
>> Paul
>>
>>
>> On 20 Mar 2015, at 06:36, Cobi Alison Smith <cobi.smith at unimelb.edu.au>
>> wrote:
>>
>> Steven – yes, (unintentional?) secrecy around plans for an OK Festival
>> down under was one of my frustrations, I’m glad it came to mind J
>>
>> Another of my frustrations has been difficulties in documenting OK
>> activities, which led for example to me creating this
>> https://pad.okfn.org/p/opendevaus rather than writing a blog post or
>> documenting it in any way on the actual OKFNau website. Likewise no
>> documentation of the open data journalism group at The Age early last year,
>> which is acknowledge via logos here
>> http://datajournalismcourse.net/learninggroups.php but nowhere on the
>> OKFNau site. I mention that for two reasons:
>> 1)      acknowledging I have also been complicit in lack of transparency
>> via lack of documentation of stuff happening J
>> 2)      noting that including the range of activities and discussion
>> outcomes (like Will’s recent example) makes a case for broad support for a
>> festival, as opposed to engaging the same people and seeking support from
>> the same places based on assumptions about who & what OK in Australia is
>> and does.
>>
>> I’m hoping OK in Australia is going to move towards a more open and
>> accessible platform for contributions, like http://publiclab.org or any
>> such wiki-based org, and I hope the festival will have an open and
>> transparent planning and submissions process, like
>> http://wikimania2014.wikimedia.org for example.
>>
>> *From:* okfn-au [mailto:okfn-au-bounces at lists.okfn.org
>> <okfn-au-bounces at lists.okfn.org>] *On Behalf Of *Steven De Costa
>> *Sent:* Friday, 20 March 2015 6:11 AM
>> *To:* Open Knowledge discussion list for Australia.
>> *Subject:* Re: [@OKFNau] speaking of values...
>>
>> That all sounds fair Cobi :)
>>
>> Venting some frustration is healthy too. Open doors lead to all kinds of
>> places.
>>
>> What is the lack of transparency you are talking about regarding okfnau?
>> We have a Board meeting only just recently set for 31 March. It would be
>> good to know what you are referring to so it can be sorted out :)
>>
>> I hope to do a blog post on the board meeting dates soon - probably
>> Saturday as I'm on flights and such in about an hour.
>>
>> Happy to also take any questions from anyone on this list into the agenda
>> too. It should be a good meeting as a bunch of things will be ticked off
>> and allow for more clarity all-round regarding 2015.
>>
>> Cheers,
>> Steven
>>
>>
>> *STEVEN DE COSTA *|
>> *EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR*www.linkdigital.com.au
>>
>>
>>
>> On 19 March 2015 at 15:04, Cobi Alison Smith <cobi.smith at unimelb.edu.au>
>> wrote:
>> To throw the cat among the pigeons, I’m going to add a couple of points:
>>
>>
>> -          I don’t think OKFNau is in a great position to be pushing for
>> change right now, given lack of transparency about upcoming plans &
>> governance changes in the wake of broader OK changes. It’s easy to
>> criticise; it’s harder to lead by example. Consider how hard it is for
>> OKFNau to manage this – then consider government departments which have way
>> more inertia & less knowledge. Yes, OK folk are volunteers whereas
>> government employees get paid, and yes change should and will happen – but
>> I think OKFNau is unintentionally complacent in the same way governments
>> can be.
>>
>>
>>
>> -          I want to echo and amplify Rosie’s comment that you can speak
>> but that doesn’t mean people will hear. And when people express frustration
>> via jokes about violence, it means those of us who are trying to be heard
>> and create change within organizations have to deal with more barriers. The
>> last thing we need in Australia is for transparency to be further
>> undermined by perceived risks of kneecapping, kidnapping, or any kind of
>> bogus security paranoia. Less hostility and more inclusivity please. The
>> more folk from government who are on this list asking for help the better;
>> making them feel unwelcome via sneers & such isn’t conducive to positive
>> change.
>>
>>
>> Incidentally, Rosie have you considered a Shuttleworth Fellowship?
>> https://www.shuttleworthfoundation.org/applications/ I was being
>> encouraged to apply while I was in Geneva last year – I think you deserve
>> it much more.
>>
>> Cheers, Cobi
>>
>> *From:* okfn-au [mailto:okfn-au-bounces at lists.okfn.org] *On Behalf Of *Rosie
>> Williams
>> *Sent:* Thursday, 19 March 2015 12:19 PM
>> *To:* Open Knowledge discussion list for Australia.
>> *Subject:* Re: [@OKFNau] Examples of Use of Commercial Government Data
>>
>> Just this week I had to try to convince a New Enterprise Incentive Scheme
>> business advisor that what I do has value. His first comment to me was ' I
>> suspect there might copyright issues'. I then explained to him the
>> definition of open data and it's relationship to copyright. He seemed
>> unaware of the concept, not to mention a bit sceptical. How he would
>> 'advise' me remains to be seen. I spent a fair bit of the time trying to
>> explain to him that tenders and grants data are actually different things.
>> I didn't get far.
>>
>> If I am not able to convince this person of the value of what I do I will
>> be put to work cleaning hospitals. I don't mind the work but it would be
>> sad if I have to stop doing what is so valuable for society because of the
>> lack of appreciation of open data in wider society. I guess when it comes
>> to convincing people of something you can speak but that does not guarantee
>> the recipient will hear what you say. Still, I live in hope ;-)
>>
>> Apologies if you've been visiting BudgetAus this week, I've been making
>> huge changes and for long periods and both at home and the library where I
>> work the internet has been up and down like a yo-yo.  It's starting to look
>> good now though and giving me the opportunity to try new things.
>>
>> Rosie Williams BA (Sociology)
>> ________________________________________
>>
>>  NoFibs.com.au <http://nofibs.com.au/> - Open Data Reporter
>>  InfoAus.net <http://infoaus.net/> - Founder and Developer
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------
>> Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2015 02:54:03 +1100
>> From: steven.decosta at linkdigital.com.au
>> To: okfn-au at lists.okfn.org
>> Subject: Re: [@OKFNau] Examples of Use of Commercial Government Data
>>
>> You folks are cool :) great discussion going on here.
>>
>> After being in Kiev and spending a lot of time with Government officials
>> there I now realize just how lucky we are in Australia. Ukraine has 1,200
>> government services and of those only two are currently delivered via a
>> digital medium.
>>
>> There is zero bureaucratic latitude to do anything outside the law so
>> every process change starts with a change to legislation.
>>
>> Having said that I still hold to the belief that eGovernment is
>> inevitable and open data that is generated by transparently operated
>> digital government services is the 'killer app' for today's democracy.
>>
>> I expect the Federal Digital Transformation Office will help create a
>> wave of change through all levels of Australian Government and digital
>> bureaucrats will become the norm in all agencies.
>>
>> Going 'native' now has a new meaning.
>>
>> Hoots!
>>
>> On Wednesday, March 18, 2015, Tennessee Leeuwenburg <
>> tleeuwenburg at gmail.com> wrote:
>> Hi Lachlan,
>>
>> In my frustrated moments, I think that about the whole world, not just
>> government :). I think it's amazing when anyone manages to find a way to be
>> successful through openness, and it's the way of the future. If only we
>> could get there :)
>>
>> You may say I'm a dreamer, but I'm not the only one...
>>
>> -T
>>
>> On 16 March 2015 at 15:02, Lachlan Musicman <datakid at gmail.com> wrote:
>> I deserve that rebuke and I think Pia makes a good point. But it's
>> also true that from *outside* government, it can be hard to be
>> anything but cynical, and I am not often seeing that change of
>> attitude that you claim - as someone bubbling with impatience on the
>> outside, I see feet draggers and excuse makers. I think that different
>> levels of government (Fed, State, Local) probably have different
>> opinions and different levels of commitment as well. I know I should
>> be differentiating between them, but in reality, I just see a wall of
>> Government.
>>
>> Good to see the discussion take off ;)
>>
>> Cheers
>>
>> L.
>>
>>
>>
>> ------
>> The totalitarian society envisioned by George Orwell in 1984 should
>> have arrived by now. The electronic gadgets are here. The government
>> is here, ready to do what Orwell anticipated. So the power exists, the
>> motive, and the electronic hardware. But these mean nothing, because,
>> progressively more and more so, no one is listening. The new youth
>> that I see is too stupid to read, too restless and bored to watch, too
>> preoccupied to remember. The collective voice of the authorities is
>> wasted on him; he rebels. But rebels not out of theoretical,
>> ideological considerations, only out of what might be called pure
>> selfishness. Plus a careless lack of regard for the dread consequences
>> the authorities promise him if he fails to obey. He cannot be bribed
>> because what he wants he can build, steal, or in some curious,
>> intricate way acquire for himself. He cannot be intimidated because on
>> the streets and in his home he has seen and participated in so much
>> violence that it fails to cow him. He merely gets out of its way when
>> it threatens, or, if he can't escape, he fights back. When the locked
>> police van comes to carry him off to the concentration camp the guards
>> will discover that while loading the van they have failed to note that
>> another equally hopeless juvenile has slashed the tires. The van is
>> out of commission. And while the tires are being replaced, the other
>> youth siphons out all the gas from the gas tank for his souped-up
>> Chevrolet Impala and has sped off long ago.
>> ----
>> The Android and the Human, Philip K. Dick
>> sourced from
>> http://boingboing.net/2015/03/10/philip-k-dicks-androids-blu.html
>> On 15 March 2015 at 11:22, Pia Waugh <pia.waugh at gmail.com> wrote:
>> > Hi all,
>> >
>> > Just a quick one:
>> >
>> > On Fri, Mar 13, 2015 at 3:30 PM, Lachlan Musicman <datakid at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>> >
>> >> Government officials. I cannot express how grateful I am that there are
>> >> people in this organisation who can talk pretty because I just want to
>> break
>> >> their kneecaps and push them into puddles with a sneer.
>> >
>> >
>> > It'd be really cool if people could remember that "government
>> officials" are
>> > not a faceless enemy. There are a lot of us working in government to
>> improve
>> > things, and comments like this certainly don't help. If you make it a
>> > "you're either with us or agin us" then you make it very hard to
>> > collaborate, educate or change the status quo. Personally I'm finding
>> > attitudes are changing within Australian governments (fed,
>> state/territory
>> > and local) quite rapidly and I'm cautiously optimistic things will
>> continue
>> > to get better. Meanwhile, I guess we'll start issuing knee protectors as
>> > standard issue across the public service ;)
>> >
>> > Cheers,
>> > Pia
>> >
>> > _______________________________________________
>> > okfn-au mailing list
>> > okfn-au at lists.okfn.org
>> > https://lists.okfn.org/mailman/listinfo/okfn-au
>> > Unsubscribe: https://lists.okfn.org/mailman/options/okfn-au
>> >
>> _______________________________________________
>> okfn-au mailing list
>> okfn-au at lists.okfn.org
>> https://lists.okfn.org/mailman/listinfo/okfn-au
>> Unsubscribe: https://lists.okfn.org/mailman/options/okfn-au
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> --------------------------------------------------
>> Tennessee Leeuwenburg
>> http://myownhat.blogspot.com/
>> "Don't believe everything you think"
>>
>>
>> --
>> *STEVEN DE COSTA *|
>> *EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR*www.linkdigital.com.au
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________ okfn-au mailing list
>> okfn-au at lists.okfn.org https://lists.okfn.org/mailman/listinfo/okfn-au
>> Unsubscribe: https://lists.okfn.org/mailman/options/okfn-au
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> okfn-au mailing list
>> okfn-au at lists.okfn.org
>> https://lists.okfn.org/mailman/listinfo/okfn-au
>> Unsubscribe: https://lists.okfn.org/mailman/options/okfn-au
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> okfn-au mailing list
>> okfn-au at lists.okfn.org
>> https://lists.okfn.org/mailman/listinfo/okfn-au
>> Unsubscribe: https://lists.okfn.org/mailman/options/okfn-au
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> okfn-au mailing list
>> okfn-au at lists.okfn.org
>> https://lists.okfn.org/mailman/listinfo/okfn-au
>> Unsubscribe: https://lists.okfn.org/mailman/options/okfn-au
>>
>>
> _______________________________________________
> okfn-au mailing list
> okfn-au at lists.okfn.org
> https://lists.okfn.org/mailman/listinfo/okfn-au
> Unsubscribe: https://lists.okfn.org/mailman/options/okfn-au
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> okfn-au mailing list
> okfn-au at lists.okfn.org
> https://lists.okfn.org/mailman/listinfo/okfn-au
> Unsubscribe: https://lists.okfn.org/mailman/options/okfn-au
>
>
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://lists.okfn.org/pipermail/okfn-au/attachments/20150323/52f6f601/attachment-0004.html>