[okfn-za] [HacksHackers Cape Town] Open Source in Government

Thu Oct 10 18:52:57 UTC 2013

Ja, but we should at least remain on the lookout for single small breakthroughs which allow us how to work around it. For instance, what if we just let anyone allege a connection between people? Then the problem becomes crowdsourced verification, and it only needs to be “good enough”. It doesn’t have to be official, or even pristinely correct.

So the problem moves from where you thought it was, to another, perhaps solvable place.

From: Greg Kempe [mailto:gregkempe at gmail.com] 
Sent: 10 October 2013 14:55
To: Robert Elliott; Adi Eyal; Charles
Cc: hackshackers-capetown at googlegroups.com; okfn-za at lists.okfn.org; hackshackers-johannesburg at googlegroups.com; odadi at googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: [okfn-za] [HacksHackers Cape Town] Open Source in Government

Charles, I agree, this would be very interesting. I've also thought of doing something with the tender database.

But I think Adi is right: there's a lot of money to be made with that data, and a lot of incentive for people to keep it hidden. The journos would love it, the business owners less so, so there'd be some friction for sure.

Greg
On 10 October 2013 at 1:50:37 PM, Charles (chuckra at gmail.com) wrote:
For me, the biggest hit we can make in open data in SA is the companies office. If you look at what the NZ govt <http://cat.open.org.nz/tag/companies/> , for instance, has done, we have a long way to go. But I dream of being able to show a dynamic D3 <http://d3js.org/>  graph connecting all our politicians to their family members and the companies in which they are involved.

What are the chances of getting a nice REST service running at the CIPC <http://www.cipc.co.za/> , where anyone can query. We’d give journalists a field day…

Charles

From: okfn-za-bounces at lists.okfn.org [mailto:okfn-za-bounces at lists.okfn.org] On Behalf Of Robert Elliott
Sent: 09 October 2013 23:08
To: Adi Eyal
Cc: okfn-za at lists.okfn.org; hackshackers-johannesburg at googlegroups.com; hackshackers-capetown at googlegroups.com; odadi at googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: [okfn-za] [HacksHackers Cape Town] Open Source in Government

Saw this today: Department of Basic Education Bans Open Source

http://dkeats.com/index.php?action=viewsingle <http://dkeats.com/index.php?action=viewsingle&module=blog&postid=gen21Srv8Nme0_40332_1381256759&userid=7050120123> &module=blog&postid=gen21Srv8Nme0_40332_1381256759&userid=7050120123

And Delphi?!????!!

Shocker. 
—
Sent from Mailbox <https://www.dropbox.com/mailbox>  for iPhone

On Mon, Aug 5, 2013 at 4:19 PM, Adi Eyal <adi at burgercom.co.za> wrote:
Hi Niki

On 5 August 2013 16:05, Niki Moore <nikimoore007 at gmail.com> wrote:
> With reference to my previous reply.... I switched over to Linux a few
> months ago, and I am battling with it, it's not as easy as Microsoft and
> requires me to phone my support desk almost weekly to find out how to
> install programmes... and there are some of my appliances, like my scanner,
> that do not support Linux. There is a scarcity of technical support for
> people who are not computer programmers who have gone onto Linux. I have
> just been having a chat with such a chap, who was telling me that as the use
> of OSS increases, so companies are forced to offer support, but unless you
> have some basic programming knowledge, Linux is extremely frustrating. Can
> you imagine your average civil servant handling the programming required to
> open source?

I feel your pain. Funnily enough, I just bought a laptop which came
with Windows 8. I battled for about an hour trying to figure it out
and gave up in disgust. However, you're right, Linux is somewhat
difficult for non-techies. Having said that, my sexagenarian motherin
in law has been using Ubuntu for about a year now. She doesn't even
know that she's using it. I'm not trying to sell Linux on the desktop.
For most people used to Windows, it is a difficult switch. I find
MacOS difficult too, but it's mostly because it is a new interface.
Linux though is not the only open source system around. There is lot's
of software that is opensource which runs on Windows.

More importantly, bespoke software should be written as open source -
there is no reason why software which is built specifically for a
government department should be kept closed. Once built, it should be
shareable with other departments with no fee (except for installation
and support).

One last thing - I didn't mention why I thought that the open data
groups were a good avenue for this initiative. Open data by itself is
a technical area which doesn't interest most people. If we pair open
data with open government or active citizenry, we have a much more
powerful tool to change society. This project is an example of how
that can happen. Collecting data from government departments is the
first piece of the puzzle.

Adi
>
>
> On Mon, Aug 5, 2013 at 3:55 PM, Adi Eyal <adi at burgercom.co.za> wrote:
>>
>> They refuse to response to my PAIA requests. They have an open data
>> policy - they also administer Microsoft licences valuing over a
>> R100,000,000. I would like policy documents translated to real action.
>>
>> Adi
>>
>> On 5 August 2013 15:44, Niki Moore <nikimoore007 at gmail.com> wrote:
>> > Why don't you ask the SITA? They announced in their congress last year
>> > that
>> > they are moving to open-source, so they should have an idea of the spend
>> > of
>> > each department.
>> >
>> >
>> > On Mon, Aug 5, 2013 at 3:16 PM, Adi Eyal <adi at burgercom.co.za> wrote:
>> >>
>> >> Hi All
>> >>
>> >> I'm working on a personal project which these groups may find
>> >> interesting. I'd like to build a case for why moving government
>> >> departments to using open source software makes economic sense. I'm
>> >> doing this by laboriously contacting each government department and
>> >> asking them what software they use and how much they pay for it.
>> >>
>> >> Yes I know - I may be a little idealistic and a touch naive, but I'm
>> >> not trying to argue the philosophical merits of why open source
>> >> software may be better than proprietary software.
>> >>
>> >> My logic is simply:
>> >>
>> >> If government spends Rx billion annually importing proprietary
>> >> software and they rather redirect that money to the local software
>> >> community for installation, customisation, support and hosting then we
>> >> can create Y new jobs.
>> >>
>> >> It's a lot of work but hopefully I can convince a few more people to
>> >> help me. I have data from 5 departments so far with a total annual
>> >> spend of over R26m.
>> >>
>> >> I would really appreciate your help. Collecting this information is
>> >> time consuming. I plan to collect information across all spheres of
>> >> government which you can imagine is a mammoth task. Any contribution -
>> >> no matter how small would definitely ease the burden.
>> >>
>> >> If you want more information - have a look at this link:
>> >> https://github.com/adieyal/gov-software-audit
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Just one caveat - this project is not about complaining about
>> >> Microsoft or snide comments about whether government is useless,
>> >> inefficient or incompetent. I am an idealist and I prefer a naively
>> >> optimistic approach. Even if the project fails (and the odds are
>> >> against it), I think it is a worthwhile cause and will add another
>> >> voice to why this is a good thing.
>> >>
>> >> Comments welcome.
>> >>
>> >> Adi
>> >>
>> >> --
>> >> Adi Eyal
>> >> Data Specialist
>> >> phone: +27 78 014 2469
>> >> skype: adieyalcas
>> >> linkedin: http://za.linkedin.com/pub/dir/Adi/Eyal
>> >>
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>> >> To view this discussion on the web, visit
>> >>
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>> >>
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>> >>
>> >>
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > --
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>> > 7th Avenue Communications
>> > 031 - 205-8331
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>> >
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>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Adi Eyal
>> Data Specialist
>> phone: +27 78 014 2469
>> skype: adieyalcas
>> linkedin: http://za.linkedin.com/pub/dir/Adi/Eyal
>>
>> --
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>>
>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
>>
>>
>
>
>
> --
> * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
> 7th Avenue Communications
> 031 - 205-8331
> 083 - 758-4483
>
> --
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>
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>
>

--
Adi Eyal
Data Specialist
phone: +27 78 014 2469
skype: adieyalcas
linkedin: http://za.linkedin.com/pub/dir/Adi/Eyal

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