[open-science] JennyMolloy and PeterMR representing OKF at Open Science Summit

Paweł Szczęsny ps at pawelszczesny.org
Thu Oct 27 19:33:09 UTC 2011

Except that OA and OER are a bit different things. Here's quote from
Peter's email from January this year (first and last sentence,

"Pragmatically I think we separate scholarly articles ("papers") from
other efforts such as Teaching/Learning materials, and theses.

Many of us in OKF want to see Open Theses but the ground rules are
different (the copyright is normally the student's) and the challenge
is with the universities to address this rather than primary and
secondary publishers. So just as important but a different type of

Let me explain again - I'm pointing out that it's very important to
pay attention to the messages this community is spreading.

OA (understood as open access to primary literature) is very
important, especially in developing countries, but if there's no
healthcare infrastructure to apply the cutting-edge knowledge, OA
becomes almost irrelevant in the healthcare (while being crucial in
research). Peter's claim is false (or at least unsupported by any data
in case of developed countries).

OER, which is somehow wider term because it might (but doesn't have
to) include scholarly articles as well, is a different process and a
means for knowledge dissemination. OER in principle saves lives,
there's no question about it.

Mixing OA and OER creates a problem. These are different processes,
they have different stakeholders, there are different streams of money
in them. And that's not my invention - this is what this community
have thought in one of the discussions almost a year ago.

When mixing OA and OER in the messages, this community risks being
ridiculed, because it appears that we have no idea what we are
fighting for. If the audience are scientists, we'll be ignored.

Additionally, some of us, like me, rely on the leverage of this
community because we don't have enough leverage on our own in our
local communities to push things forward. A bit of responsibility for
OKFN global image would a nice addition to keeping the messages
correct and clear.

I'm sorry, I cannot explain it any simpler than that.
If you still disagree with me, just discard the message and let's
forget the whole discussion.

On Thu, Oct 27, 2011 at 7:42 PM, Peter Murray-Rust <pm286 at cam.ac.uk> wrote:
> On Thu, Oct 27, 2011 at 5:55 PM, Heather Morrison <hgmorris at sfu.ca> wrote:
>> To help people make the connection between open access and saving lives in
>> the developing, would it help:
>> -       to briefly mention Open Education? perhaps the UNESCO initiative?
>> This related initiative addresses the question of facilitating basic
>> education quite directly.
>> http://www.unesco.org/new/en/communication-and-information/access-to-knowledge/open-educational-resources/
>> -       to speak to south to south and south to north knowledge
>> dissemination? Leslie Chan is one of the experts here, perhaps he can
>> provide some specifics. In brief, as long as the focus is on the knowledge
>> production of the developed world, the needs of the developing world are
>> likely to be short-changed. Lots of research on obesity, little on
>> malnutrition or how to manage food security with little or no $ to work
>> with.
> This is great Heather,
> There is actually an immediate urgency (which has suddenly arisen) _ Jenny
> and I and other have to make a video within 24 hours. (Of course that's not
> the end of the story). We want to bolt together clips from OSS video with
> bits of Graham Steel presenting patientsLikeMe and Leslie's clip that Iryna
> posted. The video will be 5 mins long and present particularly what I and
> OKF can do NOW so there is a concentration on the December Hackathon. I'll
> explain the context later.
> P.
>> my two bits,
>> Heather Morrison
>> Doctoral Candidate, Simon Fraser University School of Communication
>> http://pages.cmns.sfu.ca/heather-morrison/
>> hgmorris at sfu.ca
>> On 2011-10-27, at 9:37 AM, Peter Murray-Rust wrote:
>> >
>> >
>> > 2011/10/27 Iryna Kuchma <iryna.kuchma at eifl.net>
>> > If we are talking about open access to scholarly publications please
>> > believe me that people in universities and research institutions in
>> > developing countries do have computers and internet. this is one of the
>> > examples of a Kenyan researcher speaking about open access: Prof. Mary
>> > Abukutsa-Onyango discusses the importance of open access for research from
>> > Kenya and other African countries (http://vimeo.com/10169351) and I can
>> > share more evidences like this.
>> >
>> > Many thanks for this. The video is exactly what Jenny and I need for a
>> > clip. It's no coincidence that it was created by Leslie Chan who is one of
>> > the group of us who dreamt up Open Research Reports.
>> >
>> > Yes, OA is absolutely critical.
>> >
>> > Best wishes,
>> > Iryna Kuchma
>> > EIFL Open Access programme manager
>> > www.eifl.net
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > --
>> > Peter Murray-Rust
>> > Reader in Molecular Informatics
>> > Unilever Centre, Dep. Of Chemistry
>> > University of Cambridge
>> > CB2 1EW, UK
>> > +44-1223-763069
>> > _______________________________________________
>> > open-science mailing list
>> > open-science at lists.okfn.org
>> > http://lists.okfn.org/mailman/listinfo/open-science
> --
> Peter Murray-Rust
> Reader in Molecular Informatics
> Unilever Centre, Dep. Of Chemistry
> University of Cambridge
> CB2 1EW, UK
> +44-1223-763069
> _______________________________________________
> open-science mailing list
> open-science at lists.okfn.org
> http://lists.okfn.org/mailman/listinfo/open-science

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