[wsfii-discuss] Economic Sustainability of Community Wireless(sorry had to resend due to incorrect hyperlink)

Thu Apr 5 16:38:12 UTC 2007

hi

so what is the business matter all about?

1. funding of local ngo's providing free trainings
2. founding a professional non-profit hardware supply (cooperative?)
3. founding of local and international non-profit ISP's

i hope we can do something about it, as a global community, focussing on
ghana this year.

grts, marco, berlin

Fred Pook wrote:
> Like this:
>
> "Intel is investing $1 billion over the next 5 years to enhance lives
> by providing access to uncompomised technology for anyone, anywhere"
>
> http://www.intel.com/intel/worldahead/index.htm
>
> Anybody on this lists knows anybody at Intel?
>
> Thanks Freddy
>
>
>
> On 4/5/07, Fred Pook <fredpook at gmail.com> wrote:
>> Ashish,
>>
>> As usual you speak sharp, practical and clear again.
>> What we need is outsiders/ marketing / pr / design type of talent to
>> push your (and our) vision. All the pieces are there. Low cost Mesh is
>> a reality (TibTec build one in Dhasa, Magip.net build one in Goa).
>> Solar panels are manufactured in Kerala, low cost. WiFi (Skype)
>> handsets are becoming mass products as we speak.
>>
>> I just can't believe that no large tech company like Linksys/Cisco or
>> a Taiwanese OEM manufacturer or Intel just picks this up and starts to
>> invest in multiple pilots and then let the communities replicate the
>> best practises...
>>
>> We need a financial shot in the arm or we at WSFII are just a fun
>> hacker club.
>>
>> Thanks Freddy
>> Magip.net
>>
>>
>> On 4/5/07, Assoc of Public ICT Tools Access Prov <list at apiap.org> wrote:
>> >
>> >
>> > Hi Jeff ,
>> >      IMHO, The issue is multi dimensional.  We are creating a supply &
>> > demand simultaneously. Thus we need to bring in Tech, social,
>> > Entrepreneurial mind together . Thus the answer will come only if
>> you bring
>> > in people outside the wireless community & talk to them of
>> solution.  They
>> > will help you identify a killer app.
>> >
>> > Today rural folks in Asia or Africa is not soo tech savvy as his
>> European
>> > counterpart . to evaluate whats best for him in long term .  They just
>> > lap-up whats available , packaged well & dependable.
>> >
>> > Now  let me attempt an analogy, Some of us met at Dharamshala - for
>> Airjaldi
>> > event . The town is in one of the poorest federal state of India ,
>> Himachal
>> > Pradesh.
>> >
>> > The Per capita Income is just 1/10th of Finland .  But almost 1 in
>> 6 own a
>> > mobile phone ! . & for most the cost of communication is almost 10%
>> of their
>> > family budget.
>> >
>> http://www.mobilepundit.com/2006/11/26/every-6th-person-in-himachal-has-a-mobile/
>>
>> >
>> >
>> > The poor Himchalis have no choice but to buy it , cause there is a
>> long
>> > waiting line for POTs  &  the service is just not dependable.  &
>> there is no
>> > one to offer an alternative untill the cell phones came in.
>> >
>> > Now 70% of the network is owned a by single operator & 70% of
>> Handsets are
>> > supplied by the finnish company Nokia.
>> >
>> > Now won't it be an exciting proposition to help them slash the
>> budget by a
>> > third. ie 3%  ( = to world average )
>> >
>> > So if Voice is a killer app & if you can help bring a plan where
>> you can not
>> > only reduce your budget  & maybe as well Profit from Participation,
>> like a
>> > FON http://www.fon.com/en/ . by investing nominal money.
>> >
>> > Ofcourse there are lot of  issues involved . we need to work out on to
>> > optimise on a matrix of the topology which will require least
>> access point &
>> >  maximum people participating , thus spreading the cost.
>> >
>> > The initial seed capital .... & many other issues.
>> >
>> > If we present with say 5 application areas / solutions .  The
>> community will
>> > come forward and align with the solution which is to their best
>> interest.
>> >
>> > Ok I spoke enough may be its time for a feast for some of you . :)
>> >
>> > Ashish
>> >
>> >
>> > On 4/5/07, jeff buderer <jeff at onevillagefoundation.org> wrote:
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > Ashish,
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > Thanks for the comments. This reminds me of the Motoman projects
>> that
>> > First Mile Solutions has been involved with in India , Cambodia and
>> Rwanda .
>> > >
>> > > http://www.firstmilesolutions.com/
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > So if we could consider the India Telecom approach as a potential
>> model,
>> > how would we address funding CWN effort in terms of cost sharing the
>> > infrastructure, sustaining operational costs and
>> replication/expanding to
>> > other regions? Can you help me to understand the specifics?
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > Jeff
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > -----Original Message-----
>> > > From: wsfii-discuss-bounces at lists.okfn.org
>> > [mailto:wsfii-discuss-bounces at lists.okfn.org] On Behalf Of
>> > Assoc of Public ICT Tools Access Prov
>> > > Sent: Monday, April 02, 2007 6:45 AM
>> > > To: Discuss list on the World Summit on Free Information
>> Infrastructure
>> > > Subject: Re: [wsfii-discuss] Economic Sustainability of Community
>> > Wireless(sorry had to resend due to incorrect hyperlink)
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > Lindsey, Jeff, Ian
>> > >       I completely agree  with your observations.
>> > >  I pointed out in our panel Discussion on: Business Models for
>> Community
>> > Wireless Networks held at Dharamsala .  about India's early 1980s
>> experiment
>> > in bringing the telephone penetration into rural area.  The trick
>> was a
>> > simple  business model of  " Public Call Office " ( PCO ) .
>> > >
>> > > A simple 'plug and play '  telephone instrument &  billing
>> machine  did
>> > the trick in exponentially increasing the telecom reach.
>> > >
>> > > The community wireless can easily repeat the story provided  you
>> make
>> > participation in network simple , prosperous & address some
>> immediate needs.
>> > >
>> > > Best wishes
>> > > Ashish Saboo
>> > > Association of Public ICT Tools Access Provider
>> > > URL : http://www.apiap.org
>> > > Blog: http://apiap.blogspot.com
>> > > News: http://internetcafenews.blogspot.com
>> > > alt email : apiap at rediffmail.com
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > On 3/30/07, Ian Howard < ihoward at netdotworking.com> wrote:
>> > >
>> > > Lindsey, Jeff,
>> > >
>> > > Indeed, I would like to second what Jeff suggests, though there are
>> > > differing view within the community for the role of business in free
>> > > information infrastructures, there is at least a consensus that
>> > > sustainable models are required to support these infrastructures.
>> There
>> > > is also, I might add, a vast difference in the interests (at
>> least from
>> > > an economic perspective) between groups who are focused on community
>> > > networks in developed economies, to those who are working in
>> developing
>> > > economies. I suggest that we not try and lump them together, as the
>> > > strategies and economic foundations are completely different, IMHO.
>> > >
>> > > In the upcoming release of the WNDW book, we intend to add in this
>> > > section, that is an "Economic Sustainability" section of the
>> book. This
>> > > is a topic that we have been dedicated to for the past number of
>> years,
>> > > since our time at Geekcorps Mali. There is a growing interest in
>> this
>> > > topic and generally in the economic models to support free
>> > > infrastructures. This chapter will, of course, focus on
>> developing world
>> > > applications.
>> > >
>> > > Ian
>> > >
>> > > Adapted Consulting
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > jeff buderer wrote:
>> > > > Lindsey,
>> > > >
>> > > > One related issue may be a misconception by some that WSFII is
>> > > > anti-business. Several have commented on this to me personally.
>> It may
>> > > > be that many of us are anti-corporate status quo but that does
>> not mean
>> > > > we are anti-business or anti-corprorate. Most of us here (it
>> seems) do
>> > > > want to find a viable way to do what we are doing as it relates to
>> > > > wireless and so that means business/social enterprise
>> development. Some
>> > > > of us are even open to in the right conditions working with
>> corporations
>> > > > to get our work more widely known and to provide funding to
>> sustain our
>> > > > work.
>> > > >
>> > > > It was my uderstanding that a focus point/goal for the Air
>> Jaldi Summit
>> > > > was to investigate sustainable business models for wireless
>> networks.
>> > > > However it is not clear to me what was actually gained on a
>> practical
>> > > > level and what if there was any exploration in terms of how to
>> build
>> > > > economically sustainable wireless networks particularly in
>> emerging
>> > > > markets.
>> > > >
>> > > > Apparently very few people attended Laura Drewett's Workshop
>> "Economics
>> > > > of Small Wireless Networks
>> > > >
>> >
>> http://summit.airjaldi.com/home/program/workshops/economics-for-small-se
>> > > > rvice-operators/" (also some great resources here
>> > > > http://resources.airjaldi.com/?page_id=23)at AJS.
>> > > >
>> > > > Possibly there is a bit too much focusing on the engineering and
>> > > > technical solutions and not enough on making the business model
>> work.
>> > > > This complements an effective strategy of promotion.
>> Furthermore we need
>> > > > a "complete ecosystem approach" that combines the best of breed
>> > > > technologies and approaches to develop networks that can be
>> scaled and
>> > > > replicated moving the whole network forward in terms of as you say
>> > > > "hitting the mark".
>> > > >
>> > > > The three main considerations I see are:
>> > > > 1. Economic sustainability - Enable weaning off of grants and
>> towards
>> > > > incuation of local ICT related ventures esp in emerging markets 2.
>> > > > Social infrastructure -  Social/technological/economic
>> > infrastucture
>> > > > integrated is necessary to ensure network sustainability. 3.
>> Technology
>> > > > innovations - with good integrated with the economic and social
>> > > > innovations in the network (1 & 2)
>> > > >
>> > > > I would like to see the Economic Sustainability of Community
>> Wireless as
>> > > > a major theme at the WSFII Africa 2007 Summit. I will begin
>> work to
>> > > > incorporate the issue  of economic sustainability and
>> (complementary to
>> > > > this marketing) into our planning for the Summit.
>> > > >
>> > > > Possibly we could use the materials in your email as a starting
>> point
>> > > > for planning a session on the effective promotion of community
>> wireless
>> > > > networks.
>> > > >
>> > > > A capstone session could include people getting together in a
>> workgroup
>> > > > (along the lines of what I had proposed for AJS
>> > > >
>> >
>> http://summit.airjaldi.com/wiki/index.php/Integrated.Development.Approac
>> > > > h) and looking at the best practices in wireless network with
>> an eye for
>> > > > integration. We can then consider as part of the workshop not
>> just a
>> > > > peicemeal approach but consider how we can effectively
>> integrate all the
>> > > > pieces to great compelling projects that speak for themselves.
>> This
>> > > > would include consideration of how to build business models to
>> maximize
>> > > > the replication of these wsfii projects.
>> > > >
>> > > > Jeff
>> > > >
>> > > >
>> > > >
>> > > >
>> > > >
>> > > > This post, combined with the previous one about creating video
>> footage
>> > > > about wsfii type projects, are of great interest to me
>> personally as
>> > > > they have cropped up in UK conversations for several years, and
>> > > > particularly recently.
>> > > >
>> > > > It has always seemed to be one area where community
>> wi-fi/broadband
>> > > > networks haven't always hit the mark - whether with governments,
>> > > > funders, local authorities, establishing credibility with
>> consumers etc.
>> > > > Mainly, it has seemed, cos we are so busy trying to get the
>> solutions to
>> > > > work, that there is little time for self-promotion.
>> > > >
>> > > > In each community, and globally, we have a mix of skills. Techies,
>> > > > support, coders, promoters, grant seekers etc.
>> > > >
>> > > > I would like to propose, in light of the posts about case
>> studies and
>> > > > video footage, that we get together those who are very
>> interested in the
>> > > > marketing and promotion side of community broadband networks,
>> and talk
>> > > > amongst ourselves. Just from last week's talks with Freifunk and
>> > > > Funkfeuer for some EU research for the rural broadband
>> conference in
>> > > > Brussels in May, we have found that we have contacts between us
>> covering
>> > > > most of the EU, and then some in US, Asia and Australia.
>> Errr... in
>> > > > fact, global contacts!! After all, this community broadband
>> world is not
>> > > > very big, yet. ;o)
>> > > >
>> > > > If everyone could decide which event to go to this summer in EU
>> (!),
>> > > > perhaps we could have one track for those of us interested in
>> promoting
>> > > > community broadband activity, and tie it in with the amazing
>> work coming
>> > > > from the other side of the Atlantic through Sasha, Alison etc,
>> and in
>> > > > Asia, and start making a much bigger impact by working together.
>> > > >
>> > > > Or just start it all online through a separate list about
>> promotional
>> > > > activity to get the word out about the grassroots' efforts ongoing
>> > > > across the world?
>> > > >
>> > > > I'm happy to be amongst the UK/EU contacts more than happy to get
>> > > > involved in that type of work, and push to get together TV/video
>> > > > footage, and publicise the case studies etc created by us all
>> wherever
>> > > > we are.
>> > > >
>> > > > Let's JFDI?!
>> > > >
>> > > > ATB
>> > > > Lindsey Annison
>> > > > l.annisonatgmail.com
>> > > > Co-founder, Access to Broadband Campaign
>> > > > http://www.ABCampaign.org
>> > > > Founder member, Community Broadband Network
>> http://www.broadband-uk.coop
>> > > >
>> > > > Author: JFDI Community Broadband: Wennington
>> > > > http://www.lulu.com/content/488550
>> > > >
>> > > >
>> > > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > --
>> > > Association of Public ICT Tools Access Provider
>> > > http://www.apiap.org
>> > > _______________________________________________
>> > > wsfii-discuss mailing list
>> > > wsfii-discuss at lists.okfn.org
>> > > http://lists.okfn.org/mailman/listinfo/wsfii-discuss
>> > >
>> > >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > --
>> > Association of Public ICT Tools Access Provider
>> > http://www.apiap.org
>> > _______________________________________________
>> > wsfii-discuss mailing list
>> > wsfii-discuss at lists.okfn.org
>> > http://lists.okfn.org/mailman/listinfo/wsfii-discuss
>> >
>> >
>>
>
> _______________________________________________
> wsfii-discuss mailing list
> wsfii-discuss at lists.okfn.org
> http://lists.okfn.org/mailman/listinfo/wsfii-discuss
>