[@OKau] Move from the mailing list to the new OK Forum?

Cobi Alison Smith cobi.smith at unimelb.edu.au
Sat Jun 6 04:25:52 UTC 2015

Thanks for sharing this link Steven - I hadn't read it yet. I think it does articulate Rosie's concerns well, if I understand you right Rosie, which I may not :)

Maybe most people have perceptions of themselves - whether they see themselves as developers or advocates or otherwise - as 'caring' in ways that aren't noticed by others. I've been reflecting on reconciliation week and that article about hackerspaces I shared recently: https://www.academia.edu/12034526/The_Proper_Care_and_Feeding_of_Hackerspaces_Care_Ethics_and_Cultures_of_Making

Could tech development be a caring profession? Could codes of ethics for caring professions apply to developers? I unexpectedly came across this from searching about caring and coding:
I replaced 'public health' with 'open knowledge' thinking about the principles to see how it would fit for the OK community. I think it's possible :)

I hope everyone has a great weekend.

Best wishes, Cobi

Ps. from the link Steven shared:
Skeptics have coined the term “open-washing” as attempts for governments to be perceived as open, while keeping all important decisions and actions closed. And, alongside many others, we commonly complain that “openness” always seems to end at high-value datasets by which governments may feel threatened. And given our field’s focus on delivering services rather than engaging the user or tackling these larger problems, these criticisms have some merit.

From: okfn-au [okfn-au-bounces at lists.okfn.org] on behalf of Steven De Costa [steven.decosta at linkdigital.com.au]
Sent: Friday, 5 June 2015 7:47 PM
To: Open Knowledge discussion list for Australia.
Subject: Re: [@OKau] Move from the mailing list to the new OK Forum?

I think this might help communicate Rosie's point: http://sunlightfoundation.com/blog/2015/06/03/we-should-demand-more-from-open-than-just-data-thoughts-on-the-international-open-data-conference/

Either way I think we are lucky to have a very grass roots group in OKAU right now. Plenty of room for everyone to contribute and do good work :)

On Friday, June 5, 2015, Paul Walsh <paulywalsh at gmail.com<mailto:paulywalsh at gmail.com>> wrote:
Back to Stephen Gates’ original suggestion:

The one take home I have from this thread is that an OKau forum would be able to:

1. Replace this mailing list, with a category that matches the general agenda of this mailing list (specialist/core whatever)
2. Provide a platform for our categories (lists) that are less specialised, and/or topical in nature. This could provide more friendly entry points for discussions that are less technological/domain-driven, and more topical: eg: immigration, domestic violence, government spend, education - whatever need arises based on the people who come and get involved.

Remember: Discourse, the software, provides full “mailing list” functionality, as well as the “forum” web interface.

I’m not sure if the OK international discourse instance is the best place for all that - maybe yes, maybe no.

If not, I’d be willing to set this up as an au-specific forum, if there is general agreement on the utility. I’m not sure if OKAU has servers, or if this is something we can ask from OKI. I can also follow that up if there is interest. While I could set it up, there would have to be some other backup from the community to maintain the server, if the need arises.

On 5 Jun 2015, at 10:31, Rosie Williams <budgetaus at hotmail.com<UrlBlockedError.aspx>> wrote:

Hi all

I agree that Paul didn't make the claim that I don't appreciate the humanity in developers, that was just my interpretation of his statement that my view of developers was 'flat'. This message has been trimmed so I can't easily check on his actual wording and that I have not again mis-stated his words but I don't want Paul or others to think I am happy to have them feel they have been mischaracterised by me here, at least not deliberately.

I agree that specifying/defining audiences matters which I feel was the point I was trying to make and with which it appeared to me Paul disagreed, quite vehemently. People here are welcome to disagree with me, I hope my opinions can stand up to scrutiny and if I am convinced otherwise then I can change my view.

While I'm at it I should also mention that when I critique the focus on developers in the open data community I do not mean to disregard our contribution. I did not make that clear earlier and I am aware that repeatedly restating my critique might cause people to feel the work of developers in open knowledge is not something I appreciate. This is not my intention and I ought to make that clear in future.


Rosie Williams BA (Sociology)
 NoFibs.com.au<http://nofibs.com.au/> - Open Data Reporter | InfoAus.net<http://infoaus.net/> - Founder and Developer

From: paulywalsh at gmail.com<UrlBlockedError.aspx>
Date: Fri, 5 Jun 2015 09:47:44 +0300
To: okfn-au at lists.okfn.org<UrlBlockedError.aspx>
Subject: Re: [@OKau] Move from the mailing list to the new OK Forum?

Hi Rosie,

You are now saying things that I didn’t say, eg, that I claimed you don’t see humanity in developers, so, I’m not going to take the discussion further. The general gist of what I’m saying is: (1) there is no “general public”, and so any attempts at engagement need to be quite a lot more subtle in defining the audience to engage with, in my opinion, and (2) every field has specialists and non-specialists, technical or otherwise - nothing new to see here.

On 5 Jun 2015, at 09:27, Rosie Williams <budgetaus at hotmail.com<UrlBlockedError.aspx>> wrote:


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