[OKFN-NL] Community hangout for Weds 26 june, re taxation and compnay registers etc

Wed Jun 26 14:10:29 UTC 2013

Hi all,

Where to find the community hangout?

And what time it is scheduled for? I'd like to listen in and see what I
can learn this time.

Cheers, Karen

On Fri, June 21, 2013 00:05, Anders Pedersen wrote:
> Thanks for sharing these points,
>
> In related news, the deal on tax havens, phantom firms and beneficial
> ownership from the G8 summit seems to be at a step in the direction of
> more
> transparency:
> http://www.one.org/us/2013/06/18/a-g8-transparency-revolution-yeah-some/
>
> For a more detailed review of the G8 deal see this great cheat
> sheet<https://docs.google.com/a/okfn.org/document/d/17DE0VBIKHqvpbNdiA7s0hcMAurBEmMjV-nxmHB75e4c/edit>
> also
> from Alan Hudson, ONE on among other things taxation and extractive
> industries.
>
> Finally, in on company taxation I also want to point you to the journalist
> guide on tax
> avoidance<http://openspending.org/resources/journo/resources/tax-avoidance-evasion.html>
> on
> OpenSpending.
>
> With this discussion in mind I would suggest that we spend some time at
> the
> *Community Hangout next week on Wednesday 26 June* to follow up on
> taxation
> and company registers.
>
> Would anyone find this interesting and possibly lead such a discussion at
> the Community Hangout?
>
> Best,
> Anders
>
>
> On 20 June 2013 15:52, Chris Taggart <countculture at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Not sure how many missing. The main problem is keeping it up to date,
>> which is tricky, even with crowdsourcing. However, yes, we could do this
>> to
>> make a point ;-)
>>
>>
>> On 20 June 2013 19:08, Sam Smith <s at msmith.net> wrote:
>>
>>> how many are missing?
>>>
>>> that sounds like an application of crowdsourcing by one of hte
>>> anti-tax-avoidance groups with a large mailing list
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Sam
>>>
>>> On 20 Jun 2013, at 18:16, Jonathan Gray <jonathan.gray at okfn.org> wrote:
>>>
>>> > Some further info from Chris...
>>> >
>>> > On 20 June 2013 17:14, Chris Taggart
>>> <chris.taggart at opencorporates.com
>>> >wrote:
>>> >
>>> >> The biggest issue with the Netherlands (and this might be something
>>> the
>>> >> Dutch press want to pick up on) is the closed nature of the Dutch
>>> Chamber
>>> >> of Commerce. Not only do they score badly on the Open Company Data
>>> Index<http://registries.opencorporates.com/jurisdiction/nl>,
>>> >> they also block the IP address of anyone who tries to scrape the
>>> data,
>>> >> including, I believe possibly OpenKVK, from whom we get the data.
>>> This
>>> is
>>> >> clearly the opposite of being open, and tends to incline one that
>>> they
>>> >> would rather the information wasn't reused, as it would lend support
>>> to
>>> >> stories such as this.
>>> >>
>>> >> We do have the vast majority of NL companies (though some we have
>>> >> relatively little data on). Increasingly we are mapping other data
>>> to
>>> it,
>>> >> and so are closing in on the situation.
>>> >> Chris
>>> >>
>>> >> -------------------------------------------------------
>>> >> OpenCorporates :: The Open Database of the Corporate World
>>> >> http://opencorporates.com
>>> >> Blog: http://blog.opencorporates.com
>>> >> Twitter: http://twitter.com/OpenCorporates
>>> >>
>>> >> OpenCorporates is published by Chrinon Ltd, a company dedicated to
>>> >> improving and publishing public data under an open licence that
>>> allows
>>> and
>>> >> encourages reuse, including commercially. Registered in England,
>>> number
>>> >> 07444723.
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >> On 20 June 2013 14:13, Jonathan Gray <jonathan.gray at okfn.org> wrote:
>>> >>
>>> >>> Chris: could you shed any light on this?
>>> >>>
>>> >>>
>>> >>> On 20 June 2013 14:58, Anders Pedersen <anders.pedersen at okfn.org>
>>> wrote:
>>> >>>
>>> >>>> Thanks Jonathan,
>>> >>>>
>>> >>>> From the article:
>>> >>>> "12,000 multinational holding companies, of which 75% are based at
>>> >>>> trust offices"
>>> >>>>
>>> >>>> It would be interesting to map the density of the trust offices
>>> across
>>> >>>> the country. As we can pull Dutch company data including addresses
>>> from
>>> >>>> Opencorporates and as the Dutch postal codes are very small
>>> entities, it
>>> >>>> should be possible to map this.
>>> >>>>
>>> >>>> When it comes to access to corporate financial data in NL, things
>>> are,
>>> >>>> as far as I know, much more complicated. Opencorporates is pulling
>>> >>>> information from the Securities and Exchange Commission, SEC (US)
>>> and this
>>> >>>> could possibly be one of the best sources of Dutch corporate
>>> financial
>>> >>>> information at the moment.
>>> >>>>
>>> >>>> Anders
>>> >>>>
>>> >>>> On 20 June 2013 07:46, Jonathan Gray <jonathan.gray at okfn.org>
>>> wrote:
>>> >>>>
>>> >>>>> Apparently "€278bn flow through shell companies based in the
>>> >>>>> Netherlands every year". [1]
>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>> Wonder if this is something that any OpenSpending folks in NL
>>> have
>>> >>>>> looked into?
>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>> All the best,
>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>> Jonathan
>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>> [1]
>>> >>>>>
>>> http://www.dutchnews.nl/news/archives/2013/06/the_netherlands_is_not_a_tax_h.php
>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>> --
>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>> Jonathan Gray
>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>> Director of Policy and Ideas  | *@jwyg
>>> <https://twitter.com/jwyg>*
>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>> The Open Knowledge Foundation <http://okfn.org/>
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>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>
>>> >>>>
>>> >>>> --
>>> >>>> *
>>> >>>>
>>> >>>> Anders Pedersen
>>> >>>>
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>>> https://twitter.com/>
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>>> >>>
>>> >>>
>>> >>> --
>>> >>>
>>> >>> Jonathan Gray
>>> >>>
>>> >>> Director of Policy and Ideas  | *@jwyg <https://twitter.com/jwyg>*
>>> >>>
>>> >>> The Open Knowledge Foundation <http://okfn.org/>
>>> >>> *
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>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > --
>>> >
>>> > Jonathan Gray
>>> >
>>> > Director of Policy and Ideas  | *@jwyg <https://twitter.com/jwyg>*
>>> >
>>> > The Open Knowledge Foundation <http://okfn.org/>
>>> > *
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>>> --
>>> @smithsam
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
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>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> -------------------------------------------------------
>> OpenCorporates :: The Open Database of the Corporate World
>> http://opencorporates.com
>>  OpenlyLocal :: Making Local Government More Transparent
>> http://openlylocal.com
>> Blog: http://countculture.wordpress.com
>> Twitter: http://twitter.com/CountCulture
>>
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>
>
> --
> *
>
> Anders Pedersen
>
> Community Coordinator  |  skype: anpehej  |  @anpe <https://twitter.com/>
>
> The Open Knowledge Foundation <http://okfn.org/>
>
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>
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-- 
K.F.Brzezinska