No subject
Sun Mar 31 09:34:23 UTC 2013
* Entity (person or organisation)
* Interaction (shareholder-in, partner-with, contract-with,
employee-of, colleague-with, friend-of etc.)
o This should include some sort of basis: link or document.
* Entity (person or organisation)
So we would end up with a interactions graph dataset. This could initially
be a google spread sheet or a simple db or wiki until it gets large enough
to warrant a NoSQL graph db.
On Fri, Oct 11, 2013 at 10:26 AM, Thoko Madonko <thoko.madonko at gmail.com>
wrote:
Dear All
I am following the discussion with keen interest. Would there be a way to
start small - I am thinking given the health reform taking place in SA - a
3d picture of who is connected to which medical scheme would be a great
start!
Let me know if you are keen. I am sure I can find some cash monies to help
do it.
Thoko
__________________________________________
https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-t95JVjwQ9CA/UA05IlbsDbI/AAAAAAAAAEM/VMgnq
NjABOc/s314/buscard.jpg
On 10 October 2013 14:55, Greg Kempe <gregkempe at gmail.com> wrote:
Charles, I agree, this would be very interesting. I've also thought of doing
something with the tender database.
But I think Adi is right: there's a lot of money to be made with that data,
and a lot of incentive for people to keep it hidden. The journos would love
it, the business owners less so, so there'd be some friction for sure.
Greg
On 10 October 2013 at 1:50:37 PM, Charles (chuckra at gmail.com) wrote:
For me, the biggest hit we can make in open data in SA is the companies
office. If you look at what the NZ govt
<http://cat.open.org.nz/tag/companies/> , for instance, has done, we have a
long way to go. But I dream of being able to show a dynamic D3
<http://d3js.org/> graph connecting all our politicians to their family
members and the companies in which they are involved.
What are the chances of getting a nice REST service running at the CIPC
<http://www.cipc.co.za/> , where anyone can query. We'd give journalists a
field day.
Charles
From: okfn-za-bounces at lists.okfn.org [mailto:okfn-za-bounces at lists.okfn.org]
On Behalf Of Robert Elliott
Sent: 09 October 2013 23:08
To: Adi Eyal
Cc: okfn-za at lists.okfn.org; hackshackers-johannesburg at googlegroups.com;
hackshackers-capetown at googlegroups.com; odadi at googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: [okfn-za] [HacksHackers Cape Town] Open Source in Government
Saw this today: Department of Basic Education Bans Open Source
http://dkeats.com/index.php?action=viewsingle
<http://dkeats.com/index.php?action=viewsingle&module=blog&postid=gen21Srv8N
me0_40332_1381256759&userid=7050120123>
&module=blog&postid=gen21Srv8Nme0_40332_1381256759&userid=7050120123
And Delphi?!????!!
Shocker.
-
Sent from Mailbox <https://www.dropbox.com/mailbox> for iPhone
On Mon, Aug 5, 2013 at 4:19 PM, Adi Eyal <adi at burgercom.co.za> wrote:
Hi Niki
On 5 August 2013 16:05, Niki Moore <nikimoore007 at gmail.com> wrote:
> With reference to my previous reply.... I switched over to Linux a few
> months ago, and I am battling with it, it's not as easy as Microsoft and
> requires me to phone my support desk almost weekly to find out how to
> install programmes... and there are some of my appliances, like my
scanner,
> that do not support Linux. There is a scarcity of technical support for
> people who are not computer programmers who have gone onto Linux. I have
> just been having a chat with such a chap, who was telling me that as the
use
> of OSS increases, so companies are forced to offer support, but unless you
> have some basic programming knowledge, Linux is extremely frustrating. Can
> you imagine your average civil servant handling the programming required
to
> open source?
I feel your pain. Funnily enough, I just bought a laptop which came
with Windows 8. I battled for about an hour trying to figure it out
and gave up in disgust. However, you're right, Linux is somewhat
difficult for non-techies. Having said that, my sexagenarian motherin
in law has been using Ubuntu for about a year now. She doesn't even
know that she's using it. I'm not trying to sell Linux on the desktop.
For most people used to Windows, it is a difficult switch. I find
MacOS difficult too, but it's mostly because it is a new interface.
Linux though is not the only open source system around. There is lot's
of software that is opensource which runs on Windows.
More importantly, bespoke software should be written as open source -
there is no reason why software which is built specifically for a
government department should be kept closed. Once built, it should be
shareable with other departments with no fee (except for installation
and support).
One last thing - I didn't mention why I thought that the open data
groups were a good avenue for this initiative. Open data by itself is
a technical area which doesn't interest most people. If we pair open
data with open government or active citizenry, we have a much more
powerful tool to change society. This project is an example of how
that can happen. Collecting data from government departments is the
first piece of the puzzle.
Adi
>
>
> On Mon, Aug 5, 2013 at 3:55 PM, Adi Eyal <adi at burgercom.co.za> wrote:
>>
>> They refuse to response to my PAIA requests. They have an open data
>> policy - they also administer Microsoft licences valuing over a
>> R100,000,000. I would like policy documents translated to real action.
>>
>> Adi
>>
>> On 5 August 2013 15:44, Niki Moore <nikimoore007 at gmail.com> wrote:
>> > Why don't you ask the SITA? They announced in their congress last year
>> > that
>> > they are moving to open-source, so they should have an idea of the
spend
>> > of
>> > each department.
>> >
>> >
>> > On Mon, Aug 5, 2013 at 3:16 PM, Adi Eyal <adi at burgercom.co.za> wrote:
>> >>
>> >> Hi All
>> >>
>> >> I'm working on a personal project which these groups may find
>> >> interesting. I'd like to build a case for why moving government
>> >> departments to using open source software makes economic sense. I'm
>> >> doing this by laboriously contacting each government department and
>> >> asking them what software they use and how much they pay for it.
>> >>
>> >> Yes I know - I may be a little idealistic and a touch naive, but I'm
>> >> not trying to argue the philosophical merits of why open source
>> >> software may be better than proprietary software.
>> >>
>> >> My logic is simply:
>> >>
>> >> If government spends Rx billion annually importing proprietary
>> >> software and they rather redirect that money to the local software
>> >> community for installation, customisation, support and hosting then we
>> >> can create Y new jobs.
>> >>
>> >> It's a lot of work but hopefully I can convince a few more people to
>> >> help me. I have data from 5 departments so far with a total annual
>> >> spend of over R26m.
>> >>
>> >> I would really appreciate your help. Collecting this information is
>> >> time consuming. I plan to collect information across all spheres of
>> >> government which you can imagine is a mammoth task. Any contribution -
>> >> no matter how small would definitely ease the burden.
>> >>
>> >> If you want more information - have a look at this link:
>> >> https://github.com/adieyal/gov-software-audit
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Just one caveat - this project is not about complaining about
>> >> Microsoft or snide comments about whether government is useless,
>> >> inefficient or incompetent. I am an idealist and I prefer a naively
>> >> optimistic approach. Even if the project fails (and the odds are
>> >> against it), I think it is a worthwhile cause and will add another
>> >> voice to why this is a good thing.
>> >>
>> >> Comments welcome.
>> >>
>> >> Adi
>> >>
>> >> --
>> >> Adi Eyal
>> >> Data Specialist
>> >> phone: +27 78 014 2469 <tel:%2B27%2078%20014%202469>
>> >> skype: adieyalcas
>> >> linkedin: http://za.linkedin.com/pub/dir/Adi/Eyal
>> >>
>> >> --
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>> >> To view this discussion on the web, visit
>> >>
>> >>
https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/hackshackers-capetown/CAEQY0Y7dUmS2yTVQQ4u
UH_%3DU4STfWQBSOkNgDF4SUhbVoBtVUQ%40mail.gmail.com.
>> >>
>> >> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > --
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>> > 7th Avenue Communications
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>> >
>> > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
>> >
>> >
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Adi Eyal
>> Data Specialist
>> phone: +27 78 014 2469 <tel:%2B27%2078%20014%202469>
>> skype: adieyalcas
>> linkedin: http://za.linkedin.com/pub/dir/Adi/Eyal
>>
>> --
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>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an
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>> To post to this group, send an email to
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>> To view this discussion on the web, visit
>>
https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/hackshackers-capetown/CAEQY0Y4Mkfd-9bH%3Dy
tVxQNZUMRrn1YP%2B0Vqa-pXxrjveTUwqhw%40mail.gmail.com.
>>
>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
>>
>>
>
>
>
> --
> * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
> 7th Avenue Communications
> 031 - 205-8331 <tel:031%20-%20205-8331>
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>
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>
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xVUG_0n2yjBmwdNd5OtmL%3DThsui%3DSkQ%40mail.gmail.com.
>
> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
>
>
--
Adi Eyal
Data Specialist
phone: +27 78 014 2469 <tel:%2B27%2078%20014%202469>
skype: adieyalcas
linkedin: http://za.linkedin.com/pub/dir/Adi/Eyal
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</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]--></head><body lang=3DEN-GB link=3Dblue =
vlink=3Dpurple style=3D'tab-interval:36.0pt'><div =
class=3DWordSection1><p class=3DMsoNormal><span class=3DSpellE><font =
size=3D2 color=3D"#1f497d" face=3DCalibri><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497=
D'>Adi</span></font></span><font size=3D2 color=3D"#1f497d" =
face=3DCalibri><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497=
D'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 =
color=3D"#1f497d" face=3DCalibri><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497=
D'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><font =
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style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497=
D'>This bothered me for<span style=3D'mso-spacerun:yes'> </span>a =
long time, and it is the thing which prevented me from starting it long =
ago.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 =
color=3D"#1f497d" face=3DCalibri><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497=
D'>But now I think that’s the press’ job. We just have to =
give them a tool good enough to credibly direct their enquiries. If, for =
instance, 50 people have indicated that <span =
class=3DSpellE>Khulubuse</span> <span class=3DSpellE>Zuma</span> is the =
nephew of Jacob <span class=3DSpellE>Zuma</span>, then it’s worth =
a <span class=3DSpellE>journo’s</span> while to verify it. Same =
with company directorships, and other connection types - even =
friendships. The journalists or other interested parties can go pay =
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don’t pretend to do that.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3D"#1f497d" face=3DCalibri><span =
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style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497=
D'>We could build in:<o:p></o:p></span></font></p><p =
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lfo1'><![if !supportLists]><font size=3D2 color=3D"#1f497d" =
face=3DCalibri><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";mso-bidi-fon=
t-family:Calibri;color:#1F497D'><span style=3D'mso-list:Ignore'>1.<font =
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color=3D"#1f497d" face=3DCalibri><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497=
D'>A simple vote-up/down count, which counts the number of people who =
agree this is true, or untrue, and publish that. =
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style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";mso-bidi-fon=
t-family:Calibri;color:#1F497D'><span style=3D'mso-list:Ignore'>2.<font =
size=3D1 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=3D'font:7.0pt "Times New =
Roman"'> =
</span></font></span></span></font><![endif]><font size=3D2 =
color=3D"#1f497d" face=3DCalibri><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497=
D'>A simple <span class=3DSpellE>cellphone</span> token to authenticate =
the “informant” <span =
style=3D'mso-spacerun:yes'> </span>once, and prevent another =
attempt by that person on the same link. We don’t store the <span =
class=3DSpellE>cellphone</span> number after sending the first token- we =
just store a MD5 hash of the cell number against that link. So anyone =
can up/down vote a link only once, and they remain almost perfectly =
anonymous.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p><p class=3DMsoListParagraph><font =
size=3D2 color=3D"#1f497d" face=3DCalibri><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497=
D'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><font =
size=3D2 color=3D"#1f497d" face=3DCalibri><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497=
D'>But what <b style=3D'mso-bidi-font-weight:normal'><span =
style=3D'font-weight:bold;mso-bidi-font-weight:normal'>really</span></b> =
interests me is the math we can do after we have a decent relationship =
graph. We can calculate and rank effective influence, centrality, and =
many other formal metrics which are hugely informative. And we can get =
the cleverest people in the world to do it, if we keep it =
open.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 =
color=3D"#1f497d" face=3DCalibri><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497=
D'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><font =
size=3D2 color=3D"#1f497d" face=3DCalibri><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497=
D'>I love this shit.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3D"#1f497d" face=3DCalibri><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497=
D'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><font =
size=3D2 color=3D"#1f497d" face=3DCalibri><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497=
D'>C<o:p></o:p></span></font></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D1 =
color=3D"#1f497d" face=3DConsolas><span =
style=3D'font-size:8.0pt;font-family:Consolas;mso-bidi-font-family:"Times=
New =
Roman";color:#1F497D;mso-fareast-language:EN-US;mso-no-proof:yes'><o:p>&n=
bsp;</o:p></span></font></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D1 =
color=3D"#1f497d" face=3DConsolas><span =
style=3D'font-size:8.0pt;font-family:Consolas;mso-bidi-font-family:"Times=
New =
Roman";color:#1F497D;mso-fareast-language:EN-US;mso-no-proof:yes'>-------=
--------------<o:p></o:p></span></font></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><font =
size=3D1 color=3D"#1f497d" face=3DConsolas><span =
style=3D'font-size:8.0pt;font-family:Consolas;mso-bidi-font-family:"Times=
New =
Roman";color:#1F497D;mso-fareast-language:EN-US;mso-no-proof:yes'>Charles=
Marais<o:p></o:p></span></font></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D1 =
color=3D"#1f497d" face=3DConsolas><span =
style=3D'font-size:8.0pt;font-family:Consolas;mso-bidi-font-family:"Times=
New =
Roman";color:#1F497D;mso-fareast-language:EN-US;mso-no-proof:yes'><a =
href=3D"mailto:chuckra at gmail.com">chuckra at gmail.com</a><o:p></o:p></span>=
</font></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D1 color=3D"#1f497d" =
face=3DConsolas><span =
style=3D'font-size:8.0pt;font-family:Consolas;mso-bidi-font-family:"Times=
New =
Roman";color:#1F497D;mso-fareast-language:EN-US;mso-no-proof:yes'>Skype: =
chuckra<o:p></o:p></span></font></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D1 =
color=3D"#1f497d" face=3DConsolas><span =
style=3D'font-size:8.0pt;font-family:Consolas;mso-bidi-font-family:"Times=
New =
Roman";color:#1F497D;mso-fareast-language:EN-US;mso-no-proof:yes'>-------=
--------------</span></font><font size=3D2 color=3D"#1f497d" =
face=3DConsolas><span lang=3DEN-ZA =
style=3D'font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Consolas;mso-bidi-font-family:"Time=
s New =
Roman";color:#1F497D;mso-ansi-language:EN-ZA;mso-fareast-language:EN-US;m=
so-no-proof:yes'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><font =
size=3D2 color=3D"#1f497d" face=3DCalibri><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497=
D'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><font =
size=3D2 color=3D"#1f497d" face=3DCalibri><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497=
D'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p><div =
style=3D'border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm =
0cm 0cm'><p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'margin-left:36.0pt'><b><font =
size=3D2 face=3DTahoma><span lang=3DEN-US =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";mso-fareast-f=
ont-family:"Times New =
Roman";mso-ansi-language:EN-US;font-weight:bold'>From:</span></font></b><=
font size=3D2 face=3DTahoma><span lang=3DEN-US =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";mso-fareast-f=
ont-family:"Times New Roman";mso-ansi-language:EN-US'> <span =
class=3DSpellE>Adi</span> <span class=3DSpellE>Eyal</span> =
[mailto:adi at burgercom.co.za] <br><b><span =
style=3D'font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></b> 11 October 2013 =
12:21<br><b><span style=3D'font-weight:bold'>To:</span></b> =
Charles<br><b><span style=3D'font-weight:bold'>Cc:</span></b> Robert =
Elliott; <span class=3DSpellE>Thoko</span> <span =
class=3DSpellE>Madonko</span>; Greg <span class=3DSpellE>Kempe</span>; =
okfn-za at lists.okfn.org; <span =
class=3DSpellE>hackshackers-johannesburg</span>; <span =
class=3DSpellE>hackshackers-capetown</span>; <span =
class=3DSpellE>odadi</span><br><b><span =
style=3D'font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></b> Re: [<span =
class=3DSpellE>okfn-za</span>] [<span class=3DSpellE>HacksHackers</span> =
Cape Town] Open Source in =
Government<o:p></o:p></span></font></p></div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New =
Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=3D3 =
face=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'>what about =
verification? How do you know that something is =
true?<o:p></o:p></span></font></p><div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New =
Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p></div><div>=
<p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'margin-left:36.0pt'><span =
class=3DSpellE><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'>Adi</span></font></span><o:p></o:p></p></div><=
/div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'margin-left:36.0pt'><font =
size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'><br =
clear=3Dall =
style=3D'mso-special-character:line-break'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p><=
div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:0cm;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:12.0pt;mar=
gin-left:36.0pt'><span class=3DSpellE><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New =
Roman"><span style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'>Adi</span></font></span> <span =
class=3DSpellE>Eyal</span><br>Data Specialist<br>phone: +27 78 014 =
2469<br><span class=3DSpellE>skype</span>: <span =
class=3DSpellE>adieyalcas</span><br><span =
class=3DSpellE>linkedin</span>: <a =
href=3D"http://za.linkedin.com/pub/dir/Adi/Eyal" =
target=3D"_blank">http://za.linkedin.com/pub/dir/Adi/Eyal</a><o:p></o:p><=
/p></div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:0cm;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:12.0pt;mar=
gin-left:36.0pt'><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=3D3 =
face=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'>On 11 October =
2013 11:01, Charles <<a href=3D"mailto:chuckra at gmail.com" =
target=3D"_blank">chuckra at gmail.com</a>> =
wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></font></p><div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:3=
6.0pt'><font size=3D2 color=3D"#1f497d" face=3DCalibri><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497=
D'>Robert</span></font><o:p></o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:3=
6.0pt'><font size=3D2 color=3D"#1f497d" face=3DCalibri><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497=
D'>I think it would be worth considering going with the graph databases =
from the start – otherwise the day when we upload the first large =
chunk(the voters’ roll comes to mind </span></font><font size=3D2 =
color=3D"#1f497d" face=3DWingdings><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Wingdings;color:#1F497D'>J</span></=
font><font size=3D2 color=3D"#1f497d" face=3DCalibri><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497=
D'>) will be a show-stopper until we pivot. But sure, SQL can work for =
prototypes, as long as you know you’ll be ditching it and =
rewriting…</span></font><o:p></o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:3=
6.0pt'><font size=3D2 color=3D"#1f497d" face=3DCalibri><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497=
D'> </span></font><o:p></o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:3=
6.0pt'><font size=3D2 color=3D"#1f497d" face=3DCalibri><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497=
D'>The other point is that a link between people/companies becomes more =
credible the more people “vote it” to be true. It just has =
to be good enough for a journo to follow up – so we should also =
plan for a “link-weight” parameter =
thingy.</span></font><o:p></o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:3=
6.0pt'><font size=3D2 color=3D"#1f497d" face=3DCalibri><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497=
D'> </span></font><o:p></o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:3=
6.0pt'><font size=3D2 color=3D"#1f497d" face=3DCalibri><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497=
D'> </span></font><o:p></o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:3=
6.0pt'><font size=3D2 color=3D"#1f497d" face=3DCalibri><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497=
D'>C</span></font><o:p></o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:3=
6.0pt'><font size=3D2 color=3D"#1f497d" face=3DCalibri><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497=
D'> </span></font><o:p></o:p></p><div =
style=3D'border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm =
0cm 0cm'><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:7=
2.0pt;mso-outline-level:1'><b><font size=3D2 face=3DTahoma><span =
lang=3DEN-US =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";mso-ansi-lang=
uage:EN-US;font-weight:bold'>From:</span></font></b><font size=3D2 =
face=3DTahoma><span lang=3DEN-US =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";mso-ansi-lang=
uage:EN-US'> Robert Elliott [mailto:<a =
href=3D"mailto:robert at graphflow.com" =
target=3D"_blank">robert at graphflow.com</a>] <br><b><span =
style=3D'font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></b> 11 October 2013 =
10:43<br><b><span style=3D'font-weight:bold'>To:</span></b> <span =
class=3DSpellE>Thoko</span> <span =
class=3DSpellE>Madonko</span><br><b><span =
style=3D'font-weight:bold'>Cc:</span></b> Greg <span =
class=3DSpellE>Kempe</span>; <span class=3DSpellE>Adi</span> <span =
class=3DSpellE>Eyal</span>; Charles; <a =
href=3D"mailto:okfn-za at lists.okfn.org" =
target=3D"_blank">okfn-za at lists.okfn.org</a>; <span =
class=3DSpellE>hackshackers-johannesburg</span>; <span =
class=3DSpellE>hackshackers-capetown</span>; <span =
class=3DSpellE>odadi</span></span></font><o:p></o:p></p><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=3D3 =
face=3DTahoma><span =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'><br><b><span=
style=3D'font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></b> Re: [<span =
class=3DSpellE>okfn-za</span>] [<span class=3DSpellE>HacksHackers</span> =
Cape Town] Open Source in =
Government</span></font><o:p></o:p></p></div></div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:7=
2.0pt'><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p><div><div><=
div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-bottom:12.0pt;margin-left:72.0pt'=
><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'>I think '<span =
class=3DSpellE>crowdsourcing</span>' the data is an excellent idea. =
Interactions can be 'draft' until officially confirmed as and when =
evidence becomes available. Here is a D3 example of what we could end up =
with (albeit very conspiracy-theorist): <a =
href=3D"http://www.whodotheyserve.com/" =
target=3D"_blank">http://www.whodotheyserve.com/</a><o:p></o:p></span></f=
ont></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:7=
2.0pt'><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'>From a data perspective, what we need =
is:<o:p></o:p></span></font></p><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:1=
08.0pt'><font size=3D2 face=3DSymbol><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Symbol'>·</span></font><font=
size=3D1><span =
style=3D'font-size:7.0pt'>  =
; </span></font>Entity (person or organisation)<o:p></o:p></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:1=
08.0pt'><font size=3D2 face=3DSymbol><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Symbol'>·</span></font><font=
size=3D1><span =
style=3D'font-size:7.0pt'>  =
; </span></font>Interaction (shareholder-in, partner-with, =
contract-with, employee-of, colleague-with, friend-of =
etc.)<o:p></o:p></p></div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:1=
44.0pt'><font size=3D2 face=3D"Courier New"><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier =
New"'>o</span></font><font size=3D1><span =
style=3D'font-size:7.0pt'> </span></font>This should =
include some sort of basis: link or document.<o:p></o:p></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:1=
08.0pt'><font size=3D2 face=3DSymbol><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Symbol'>·</span></font><font=
size=3D1><span =
style=3D'font-size:7.0pt'>  =
; </span></font>Entity (person or =
organisation)<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:7=
2.0pt'><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'>So we would end up with a interactions graph =
dataset. This could initially be a <span class=3DSpellE>google</span> =
spread sheet or a simple db or wiki until it gets large enough to =
warrant a <span class=3DSpellE>NoSQL</span> graph =
db.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p></div></div></div><div><div><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-bottom:12.0pt;margin-left:72.0pt'=
><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:7=
2.0pt'><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'>On Fri, Oct 11, 2013 at 10:26 AM, <span =
class=3DSpellE>Thoko</span> <span class=3DSpellE>Madonko</span> <<a =
href=3D"mailto:thoko.madonko at gmail.com" =
target=3D"_blank">thoko.madonko at gmail.com</a>> =
wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></font></p><div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:7=
2.0pt'><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'>Dear All<o:p></o:p></span></font></p><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:7=
2.0pt'><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p></div><div>=
<p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:7=
2.0pt'><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'>I am following the discussion with keen =
interest. Would there be a way to start small - I am thinking given the =
health reform taking place in SA - a 3d picture of who is connected to =
which medical scheme would be a great =
start! <o:p></o:p></span></font></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:7=
2.0pt'><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p></div><div>=
<p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:7=
2.0pt'><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'>Let me know if you are keen. I am sure I can =
find some cash monies to help do =
it. <o:p></o:p></span></font></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:7=
2.0pt'><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p></div><div>=
<p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:7=
2.0pt'><span class=3DSpellE><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New =
Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'>Thoko</span></font></span><o:p></o:p></p></div=
></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:7=
2.0pt'><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'><br clear=3Dall =
style=3D'mso-special-character:line-break'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p><=
div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:7=
2.0pt'><b><font size=3D2 color=3D"#222222" face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#222222;=
font-weight:bold'>__________________________________________</span></font=
></b><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:7=
2.0pt'><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'><span style=3D'mso-no-proof:yes'><img =
border=3D0 width=3D32 height=3D32 id=3D"_x0000_i1026" =
src=3D"https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-t95JVjwQ9CA/UA05IlbsDbI/AAAAAAA=
AAEM/VMgnqNjABOc/s314/buscard.jpg" =
alt=3D"https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-t95JVjwQ9CA/UA05IlbsDbI/AAAAAAA=
AAEM/VMgnqNjABOc/s314/buscard.jpg"></span><o:p></o:p></span></font></p></=
div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:7=
2.0pt'><font size=3D2 color=3D"#222222" face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#222222'=
> </span></font><o:p></o:p></p></div></div><div><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-bottom:12.0pt;margin-left:72.0pt'=
><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:7=
2.0pt'><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'>On 10 October 2013 14:55, Greg <span =
class=3DSpellE>Kempe</span> <<a href=3D"mailto:gregkempe at gmail.com" =
target=3D"_blank">gregkempe at gmail.com</a>> =
wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></font></p><div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:7=
2.0pt'><font size=3D2 face=3DHelvetica><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif"'>Charles, =
I agree, this would be very interesting. I've also thought of doing =
something with the tender =
database.</span></font><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:7=
2.0pt'><font size=3D2 face=3DHelvetica><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif"'> </s=
pan></font><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:7=
2.0pt'><font size=3D2 face=3DHelvetica><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif"'>But I =
think <span class=3DSpellE>Adi</span> is right: there's a lot of money =
to be made with that data, and a lot of incentive for people to keep it =
hidden. The <span class=3DSpellE>journos</span> would love it, the =
business owners less so, so there'd be some friction for =
sure.</span></font><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:7=
2.0pt'><font size=3D3 color=3D"#888888" face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;color:#888888'> </span></font><o:p></o:p><=
/p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:7=
2.0pt'><font size=3D3 color=3D"#888888" face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;color:#888888'>Greg</span></font><o:p></o:p></p=
><div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:7=
2.0pt'><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p><p =
style=3D'margin-left:72.0pt'><font size=3D3 color=3D"#a0a0a8" =
face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;color:#A0A0A8'>On 10 October 2013 at 1:50:37 =
PM, Charles (<a href=3D"mailto://chuckra@gmail.com" =
target=3D"_blank">chuckra at gmail.com</a>) =
wrote:</span></font><o:p></o:p></p><blockquote =
style=3D'margin-left:0cm;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt;border-left=
:solid!important'><div><div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:7=
2.0pt'><font size=3D2 color=3D"#1f497d" face=3DCalibri><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497=
D'>For me, the biggest hit we can make in open data in SA is the =
companies office. If you look at what the <a =
href=3D"http://cat.open.org.nz/tag/companies/" target=3D"_blank">NZ =
govt</a>, for instance, has done, we have a long way to go. But I dream =
of being able to show a dynamic <a href=3D"http://d3js.org/" =
target=3D"_blank">D3</a> graph connecting all our politicians to their =
family members and the companies in which they are =
involved.</span></font><o:p></o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:7=
2.0pt'><font size=3D2 color=3D"#1f497d" face=3DCalibri><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497=
D'> </span></font><o:p></o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:7=
2.0pt'><font size=3D2 color=3D"#1f497d" face=3DCalibri><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497=
D'>What are the chances of getting a nice REST service running at the <a =
href=3D"http://www.cipc.co.za/" target=3D"_blank">CIPC</a>, where anyone =
can query. We’d give journalists a field =
day…</span></font><o:p></o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:7=
2.0pt'><font size=3D2 color=3D"#1f497d" face=3DCalibri><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497=
D'> </span></font><o:p></o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:7=
2.0pt'><font size=3D2 color=3D"#1f497d" face=3DCalibri><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497=
D'>Charles</span></font><o:p></o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:7=
2.0pt'><font size=3D2 color=3D"#1f497d" face=3DCalibri><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497=
D'> </span></font><o:p></o:p></p><div =
style=3D'border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm =
0cm 0cm'><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:1=
08.0pt;mso-outline-level:1'><b><font size=3D2 face=3DTahoma><span =
lang=3DEN-US =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";mso-ansi-lang=
uage:EN-US;font-weight:bold'>From:</span></font></b><span lang=3DEN-US =
style=3D'mso-ansi-language:EN-US'> </span><font size=3D2 =
face=3DTahoma><span lang=3DEN-US =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";mso-ansi-lang=
uage:EN-US'><a href=3D"mailto:okfn-za-bounces at lists.okfn.org" =
target=3D"_blank">okfn-za-bounces at lists.okfn.org</a> [mailto:<a =
href=3D"mailto:okfn-za-bounces at lists.okfn.org" =
target=3D"_blank">okfn-za-bounces at lists.okfn.org</a>] <b><span =
style=3D'font-weight:bold'>On Behalf Of</span></b> Robert =
Elliott<br><b><span style=3D'font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></b> 09 =
October 2013 23:08<br><b><span style=3D'font-weight:bold'>To:</span></b> =
<span class=3DSpellE>Adi</span> <span =
class=3DSpellE>Eyal</span><br><b><span =
style=3D'font-weight:bold'>Cc:</span></b> <a =
href=3D"mailto:okfn-za at lists.okfn.org" =
target=3D"_blank">okfn-za at lists.okfn.org</a>; <a =
href=3D"mailto:hackshackers-johannesburg at googlegroups.com" =
target=3D"_blank">hackshackers-johannesburg at googlegroups.com</a>; <a =
href=3D"mailto:hackshackers-capetown at googlegroups.com" =
target=3D"_blank">hackshackers-capetown at googlegroups.com</a>; <a =
href=3D"mailto:odadi at googlegroups.com" =
target=3D"_blank">odadi at googlegroups.com</a><br><b><span =
style=3D'font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></b> Re: [<span =
class=3DSpellE>okfn-za</span>] [<span class=3DSpellE>HacksHackers</span> =
Cape Town] Open Source in =
Government</span></font><o:p></o:p></p></div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:1=
08.0pt'><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:1=
08.0pt'><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'>Saw this today: Department of Basic Education =
Bans Open Source<o:p></o:p></span></font></p></div><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:1=
08.0pt'><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p></div><div>=
<p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:1=
08.0pt'><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'><a =
href=3D"http://dkeats.com/index.php?action=3Dviewsingle&module=3Dblog=
&postid=3Dgen21Srv8Nme0_40332_1381256759&userid=3D7050120123" =
target=3D"_blank">http://dkeats.com/index.php?action=3Dviewsingle&mod=
ule=3Dblog&postid=3Dgen21Srv8Nme0_40332_1381256759&userid=3D70501=
20123</a><o:p></o:p></span></font></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:1=
08.0pt'><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p></div><div>=
<p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:1=
08.0pt'><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'>And =
Delphi?!????!!<o:p></o:p></span></font></p></div><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:1=
08.0pt'><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p></div><div>=
<p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:1=
08.0pt'><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'>Shocker. <o:p></o:p></span></font></p></d=
iv><div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:1=
08.0pt'><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'>—<br>Sent from <a =
href=3D"https://www.dropbox.com/mailbox" target=3D"_blank">Mailbox</a> =
for <span =
class=3DSpellE>iPhone</span><o:p></o:p></span></font></p></div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-bottom:12.0pt;margin-left:108.0pt=
'><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p><div><p =
style=3D'margin-left:108.0pt'><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New =
Roman"><span style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'>On Mon, Aug 5, 2013 at 4:19 PM, =
<span class=3DSpellE>Adi</span> <span class=3DSpellE>Eyal</span> <<a =
href=3D"mailto:adi at burgercom.co.za" =
target=3D"_blank">adi at burgercom.co.za</a>> =
wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></font></p><blockquote =
style=3D'border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm =
6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:5=
.0pt'><p style=3D'margin-left:108.0pt'><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New =
Roman"><span style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'>Hi <span =
class=3DSpellE>Niki</span><br><br>On 5 August 2013 16:05, <span =
class=3DSpellE>Niki</span> Moore <<a =
href=3D"mailto:nikimoore007 at gmail.com" =
target=3D"_blank">nikimoore007 at gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br>> With =
reference to my previous reply.... I switched over to Linux a =
few<br>> months ago, and I am battling with it, it's not as easy as =
Microsoft and<br>> requires me to phone my support desk almost weekly =
to find out how to<br>> install programmes... and there are some of =
my appliances, like my scanner,<br>> that do not support Linux. There =
is a scarcity of technical support for<br>> people who are not =
computer programmers who have gone onto Linux. I have<br>> just been =
having a chat with such a chap, who was telling me that as the =
use<br>> of OSS increases, so companies are forced to offer support, =
but unless you<br>> have some basic programming knowledge, Linux is =
extremely frustrating. Can<br>> you imagine your average civil =
servant handling the programming required to<br>> open =
source?<br><br>I feel your pain. Funnily enough, I just bought a laptop =
which came<br>with Windows 8. I battled for about an hour trying to =
figure it out<br>and gave up in disgust. However, you're right, Linux is =
somewhat<br>difficult for non-techies. Having said that, my sexagenarian =
<span class=3DSpellE>motherin</span><br>in law has been using <span =
class=3DSpellE>Ubuntu</span> for about a year now. She doesn't =
even<br>know that she's using it. I'm not trying to sell Linux on the =
desktop.<br>For most people used to Windows, it is a difficult switch. I =
find<br><span class=3DSpellE>MacOS</span> difficult too, but it's mostly =
because it is a new interface.<br>Linux though is not the only open =
source system around. There is <span class=3DSpellE>lot's</span><br>of =
software that is <span class=3DSpellE>opensource</span> which runs on =
Windows.<br><br>More importantly, bespoke software should be written as =
open source -<br>there is no reason why software which is built =
specifically for a<br>government department should be kept closed. Once =
built, it should be<br>shareable with other departments with no fee =
(except for installation<br>and support).<br><br>One last thing - I =
didn't mention why I thought that the open data<br>groups were a good =
avenue for this initiative. Open data by itself is<br>a technical area =
which doesn't interest most people. If we pair open<br>data with open =
government or active citizenry, we have a much more<br>powerful tool to =
change society. This project is an example of how<br>that can happen. =
Collecting data from government departments is the<br>first piece of the =
puzzle.<br><br><span class=3DSpellE>Adi</span><br>><br>><br>> =
On Mon, Aug 5, 2013 at 3:55 PM, <span class=3DSpellE>Adi</span> <span =
class=3DSpellE>Eyal</span> <<a href=3D"mailto:adi at burgercom.co.za" =
target=3D"_blank">adi at burgercom.co.za</a>> =
wrote:<br>>><br>>> They refuse to response to my PAIA =
requests. They have an open data<br>>> policy - they also =
administer Microsoft licences valuing over a<br>>> R100,000,000. I =
would like policy documents translated to real =
action.<br>>><br>>> <span =
class=3DSpellE>Adi</span><br>>><br>>> On 5 August 2013 =
15:44, <span class=3DSpellE>Niki</span> Moore <<a =
href=3D"mailto:nikimoore007 at gmail.com" =
target=3D"_blank">nikimoore007 at gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br>>> > =
Why don't you ask the SITA? They announced in their congress last =
year<br>>> > that<br>>> > they are moving to =
open-source, so they should have an idea of the spend<br>>> > =
of<br>>> > each department.<br>>> ><br>>> =
><br>>> > On Mon, Aug 5, 2013 at 3:16 PM, <span =
class=3DSpellE>Adi</span> <span class=3DSpellE>Eyal</span> <<a =
href=3D"mailto:adi at burgercom.co.za" =
target=3D"_blank">adi at burgercom.co.za</a>> wrote:<br>>> =
>><br>>> >> Hi All<br>>> >><br>>> =
>> I'm working on a personal project which these groups may =
find<br>>> >> interesting. I'd like to build a case for why =
moving government<br>>> >> departments to using open source =
software makes economic sense. I'm<br>>> >> doing this by =
laboriously contacting each government department and<br>>> =
>> asking them what software they use and how much they pay for =
it.<br>>> >><br>>> >> Yes I know - I may be a =
little idealistic and a touch naive, but I'm<br>>> >> not =
trying to argue the philosophical merits of why open source<br>>> =
>> software may be better than proprietary software.<br>>> =
>><br>>> >> My logic is simply:<br>>> =
>><br>>> >> If government spends Rx billion annually =
importing proprietary<br>>> >> software and they rather =
redirect that money to the local software<br>>> >> community =
for installation, customisation, support and hosting then we<br>>> =
>> can create Y new jobs.<br>>> >><br>>> =
>> It's a lot of work but hopefully I can convince a few more =
people to<br>>> >> help me. I have data from 5 departments =
so far with a total annual<br>>> >> spend of over =
R26m.<br>>> >><br>>> >> I would really =
appreciate your help. Collecting this information is<br>>> =
>> time consuming. I plan to collect information across all =
spheres of<br>>> >> government which you can imagine is a =
mammoth task. Any contribution -<br>>> >> no matter how =
small would definitely ease the burden.<br>>> >><br>>> =
>> If you want more information - have a look at this =
link:<br>>> >> <a =
href=3D"https://github.com/adieyal/gov-software-audit" =
target=3D"_blank">https://github.com/adieyal/gov-software-audit</a><br>&g=
t;> >><br>>> >><br>>> >> Just one =
caveat - this project is not about complaining about<br>>> =
>> Microsoft or snide comments about whether government is =
useless,<br>>> >> inefficient or incompetent. I am an =
idealist and I prefer a naively<br>>> >> optimistic =
approach. Even if the project fails (and the odds are<br>>> =
>> against it), I think it is a worthwhile cause and will add =
another<br>>> >> voice to why this is a good =
thing.<br>>> >><br>>> >> Comments =
welcome.<br>>> >><br>>> >> <span =
class=3DSpellE>Adi</span><br>>> >><br>>> >> =
--<br>>> >> <span class=3DSpellE>Adi</span> <span =
class=3DSpellE>Eyal</span><br>>> >> Data =
Specialist<br>>> >> phone: <a =
href=3D"tel:%2B27%2078%20014%202469" target=3D"_blank">+27 78 014 =
2469</a><br>>> >> <span class=3DSpellE>skype</span>: <span =
class=3DSpellE>adieyalcas</span><br>>> >> <span =
class=3DSpellE>linkedin</span>: <a =
href=3D"http://za.linkedin.com/pub/dir/Adi/Eyal" =
target=3D"_blank">http://za.linkedin.com/pub/dir/Adi/Eyal</a><br>>>=
>><br>>> >> --<br>>> >> You received this =
message because you are subscribed to the Google<br>>> >> =
Groups<br>>> >> "<span =
class=3DSpellE>HacksHackers</span> <span =
class=3DSpellE>CapeTown</span>" group.<br>>> >> To =
unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, =
send<br>>> >> an<br>>> >> email to <a =
href=3D"mailto:hackshackers-capetown+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com" =
target=3D"_blank">hackshackers-capetown+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com</a>.=
<br>>> >> To post to this group, send an email =
to<br>>> >> <a =
href=3D"mailto:hackshackers-capetown at googlegroups.com" =
target=3D"_blank">hackshackers-capetown at googlegroups.com</a>.<br>>>=
>> To view this discussion on the web, visit<br>>> =
>><br>>> >> <a =
href=3D"https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/hackshackers-capetown/CAEQY0Y7d=
UmS2yTVQQ4uUH_%3DU4STfWQBSOkNgDF4SUhbVoBtVUQ%40mail.gmail.com" =
target=3D"_blank">https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/hackshackers-capetown=
/CAEQY0Y7dUmS2yTVQQ4uUH_%3DU4STfWQBSOkNgDF4SUhbVoBtVUQ%40mail.gmail.com</=
a>.<br>>> >><br>>> >> For more options, visit <a =
href=3D"https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out" =
target=3D"_blank">https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out</a>.<br>>&g=
t; >><br>>> >><br>>> ><br>>> =
><br>>> ><br>>> > --<br>>> > * * * * * * * =
* * * * * * * * * * * *<br>>> > 7th Avenue =
Communications<br>>> > <a href=3D"tel:031%20-%20205-8331" =
target=3D"_blank">031 - 205-8331</a><br>>> > <a =
href=3D"tel:083%20-%20758-4483" target=3D"_blank">083 - =
758-4483</a><br>>> ><br>>> > --<br>>> > You =
received this message because you are subscribed to the =
Google<br>>> > Groups<br>>> > "<span =
class=3DSpellE>HacksHackers</span> <span =
class=3DSpellE>CapeTown</span>" group.<br>>> > To =
unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, =
send<br>>> > an<br>>> > email to <a =
href=3D"mailto:hackshackers-capetown+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com" =
target=3D"_blank">hackshackers-capetown+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com</a>.=
<br>>> > To post to this group, send an email to<br>>> =
> <a href=3D"mailto:hackshackers-capetown at googlegroups.com" =
target=3D"_blank">hackshackers-capetown at googlegroups.com</a>.<br>>>=
> To view this discussion on the web, visit<br>>> =
><br>>> > <a =
href=3D"https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/hackshackers-capetown/CAE02g-Mi=
aBcHkriVxe2tengvLkTKOuojeyz69RavxybS0Km1DQ%40mail.gmail.com" =
target=3D"_blank">https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/hackshackers-capetown=
/CAE02g-MiaBcHkriVxe2tengvLkTKOuojeyz69RavxybS0Km1DQ%40mail.gmail.com</a>=
.<br>>> ><br>>> > For more options, visit <a =
href=3D"https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out" =
target=3D"_blank">https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out</a>.<br>>&g=
t; ><br>>> ><br>>><br>>><br>>><br>>> =
--<br>>> <span class=3DSpellE>Adi</span> <span =
class=3DSpellE>Eyal</span><br>>> Data Specialist<br>>> =
phone: <a href=3D"tel:%2B27%2078%20014%202469" target=3D"_blank">+27 78 =
014 2469</a><br>>> <span class=3DSpellE>skype</span>: <span =
class=3DSpellE>adieyalcas</span><br>>> <span =
class=3DSpellE>linkedin</span>: <a =
href=3D"http://za.linkedin.com/pub/dir/Adi/Eyal" =
target=3D"_blank">http://za.linkedin.com/pub/dir/Adi/Eyal</a><br>>>=
<br>>> --<br>>> You received this message because you are =
subscribed to the Google Groups<br>>> "<span =
class=3DSpellE>HacksHackers</span> <span =
class=3DSpellE>CapeTown</span>" group.<br>>> To unsubscribe =
from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an<br>>> =
email to <a =
href=3D"mailto:hackshackers-capetown+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com" =
target=3D"_blank">hackshackers-capetown+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com</a>.=
<br>>> To post to this group, send an email to<br>>> <a =
href=3D"mailto:hackshackers-capetown at googlegroups.com" =
target=3D"_blank">hackshackers-capetown at googlegroups.com</a>.<br>>>=
To view this discussion on the web, visit<br>>> <a =
href=3D"https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/hackshackers-capetown/CAEQY0Y4M=
kfd-9bH%3DytVxQNZUMRrn1YP%2B0Vqa-pXxrjveTUwqhw%40mail.gmail.com" =
target=3D"_blank">https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/hackshackers-capetown=
/CAEQY0Y4Mkfd-9bH%3DytVxQNZUMRrn1YP%2B0Vqa-pXxrjveTUwqhw%40mail.gmail.com=
</a>.<br>>><br>>> For more options, visit <a =
href=3D"https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out" =
target=3D"_blank">https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out</a>.<br>>&g=
t;<br>>><br>><br>><br>><br>> --<br>> * * * * * * * =
* * * * * * * * * * * *<br>> 7th Avenue Communications<br>> <a =
href=3D"tel:031%20-%20205-8331" target=3D"_blank">031 - =
205-8331</a><br>> <a href=3D"tel:083%20-%20758-4483" =
target=3D"_blank">083 - 758-4483</a><br>><br>> --<br>> You =
received this message because you are subscribed to the Google =
Groups<br>> "<span class=3DSpellE>HacksHackers</span> <span =
class=3DSpellE>CapeTown</span>" group.<br>> To unsubscribe from =
this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an<br>> email to =
<a href=3D"mailto:hackshackers-capetown+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com" =
target=3D"_blank">hackshackers-capetown+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com</a>.=
<br>> To post to this group, send an email to<br>> <a =
href=3D"mailto:hackshackers-capetown at googlegroups.com" =
target=3D"_blank">hackshackers-capetown at googlegroups.com</a>.<br>> To =
view this discussion on the web, visit<br>> <a =
href=3D"https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/hackshackers-capetown/CAE02g-PL=
GgsFZq4BurZxVUG_0n2yjBmwdNd5OtmL%3DThsui%3DSkQ%40mail.gmail.com" =
target=3D"_blank">https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/hackshackers-capetown=
/CAE02g-PLGgsFZq4BurZxVUG_0n2yjBmwdNd5OtmL%3DThsui%3DSkQ%40mail.gmail.com=
</a>.<br>><br>> For more options, visit <a =
href=3D"https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out" =
target=3D"_blank">https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out</a>.<br>><b=
r>><br><br><br><br>--<br><span class=3DSpellE>Adi</span> <span =
class=3DSpellE>Eyal</span><br>Data Specialist<br>phone: <a =
href=3D"tel:%2B27%2078%20014%202469" target=3D"_blank">+27 78 014 =
2469</a><br><span class=3DSpellE>skype</span>: <span =
class=3DSpellE>adieyalcas</span><br><span =
class=3DSpellE>linkedin</span>: <a =
href=3D"http://za.linkedin.com/pub/dir/Adi/Eyal" =
target=3D"_blank">http://za.linkedin.com/pub/dir/Adi/Eyal</a><br><br>____=
___________________________________________<br><span =
class=3DSpellE>okfn-za</span> mailing list<br><a =
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/o:p></span></font></p></blockquote></div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:1=
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><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
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_____<br><span class=3DSpellE>okfn-za</span> mailing list<br><a =
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style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:7=
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2.0pt'><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'><br><br clear=3Dall><br>-- =
<o:p></o:p></span></font></p><div><div><div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:7=
2.0pt'><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'><a href=3D"http://www.graphflow.com/" =
target=3D"_blank"><span =
style=3D'mso-no-proof:yes;text-decoration:none;text-underline:none'><img =
border=3D0 width=3D32 height=3D32 id=3D"_x0000_i1025" =
src=3D"https://graphflow-app-data.s3.amazonaws.com/images/logosmall.png?S=
ignature=3DnKJJ5zJvKf7nTyw7HQJ6Gt32e04=3D&Expires=3D1380108276&AW=
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SAccessKeyId=3DAKIAJXFG65FWVJBIYVLA"></span></a><o:p></o:p></span></font>=
</p></div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:7=
2.0pt'><font size=3D1 color=3D"#666666" face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:7.5pt;color:#666666'>Robert Elliott | =
Co-founder</span></font><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:7=
2.0pt'><font size=3D1 color=3D"#3d85c6" face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:7.5pt;color:#3D85C6'><a =
href=3D"mailto:robert at graphflow.com" =
target=3D"_blank">robert at graphflow.com</a></span></font><font size=3D1 =
color=3D"#666666"><span style=3D'font-size:7.5pt;color:#666666'> | =
</span></font><font size=3D1 color=3D"#3d85c6"><span =
style=3D'font-size:7.5pt;color:#3D85C6'><a =
href=3D"tel:%2B27%2071%20882%204222" target=3D"_blank">+27 71 882 =
4222</a></span></font><font size=3D1 color=3D"#666666"><span =
style=3D'font-size:7.5pt;color:#666666'> | <a =
href=3D"http://twitter.com/greenafrican" target=3D"_blank"><font =
color=3D"#3d85c6"><span style=3D'color:#3D85C6'>@<span =
class=3DSpellE>greenafrican</span></span></font></a></span></font><o:p></=
o:p></p></div></div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:7=
2.0pt'><font size=3D1 color=3D"#666666" face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:7.5pt;color:#666666'><br><span =
class=3DSpellE>GraphFlow</span> | Product, user and content =
recommendations<br></span></font><font size=3D1 color=3D"#3d85c6"><span =
style=3D'font-size:7.5pt;color:#3D85C6'><a =
href=3D"http://www.graphflow.com" =
target=3D"_blank">www.graphflow.com</a></span></font><font size=3D1 =
color=3D"#666666"><span style=3D'font-size:7.5pt;color:#666666'> | =
</span></font><font size=3D1 color=3D"#3d85c6"><span =
style=3D'font-size:7.5pt;color:#3D85C6'><a =
href=3D"http://twitter.com/graphflow" target=3D"_blank">@<span =
class=3DSpellE>graphflow</span></a></span></font><o:p></o:p></p><div><div=
><div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
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></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New =
Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p></div></div=
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