No subject


Sun Mar 31 09:34:23 UTC 2013


   - Entity (person or organisation)
   - Interaction (shareholder-in, partner-with, contract-with, employee-of,
   colleague-with, friend-of etc.)
      - This should include some sort of basis: link or document.
      - Entity (person or organisation)

So we would end up with a interactions graph dataset. This could initially
be a google spread sheet or a simple db or wiki until it gets large enough
to warrant a NoSQL graph db.


On Fri, Oct 11, 2013 at 10:26 AM, Thoko Madonko <thoko.madonko at gmail.com>wr=
ote:

> Dear All
>
> I am following the discussion with keen interest. Would there be a way to
> start small - I am thinking given the health reform taking place in SA - =
a
> 3d picture of who is connected to which medical scheme would be a great
> start!
>
> Let me know if you are keen. I am sure I can find some cash monies to hel=
p
> do it.
>
> Thoko
>
> *__________________________________________*
>
> *
> *
>
>
> On 10 October 2013 14:55, Greg Kempe <gregkempe at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Charles, I agree, this would be very interesting. I've also thought of
>> doing something with the tender database.
>>
>> But I think Adi is right: there's a lot of money to be made with that
>> data, and a lot of incentive for people to keep it hidden. The journos
>> would love it, the business owners less so, so there'd be some friction =
for
>> sure.
>>
>> Greg
>>
>> On 10 October 2013 at 1:50:37 PM, Charles (chuckra at gmail.com<//chuckra at g=
mail.com>)
>> wrote:
>>
>>  For me, the biggest hit we can make in open data in SA is the companies
>> office. If you look at what the NZ govt<http://cat.open.org.nz/tag/compa=
nies/>,
>> for instance, has done, we have a long way to go. But I dream of being a=
ble
>> to show a dynamic D3 <http://d3js.org/> graph connecting all our
>> politicians to their family members and the companies in which they are
>> involved.
>>
>>
>>
>> What are the chances of getting a nice REST service running at the CIPC<=
http://www.cipc.co.za/>,
>> where anyone can query. We=92d give journalists a field day=85
>>
>>
>>
>> Charles
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* okfn-za-bounces at lists.okfn.org [mailto:
>> okfn-za-bounces at lists.okfn.org] *On Behalf Of* Robert Elliott
>> *Sent:* 09 October 2013 23:08
>> *To:* Adi Eyal
>> *Cc:* okfn-za at lists.okfn.org; hackshackers-johannesburg at googlegroups.com=
;
>> hackshackers-capetown at googlegroups.com; odadi at googlegroups.com
>> *Subject:* Re: [okfn-za] [HacksHackers Cape Town] Open Source in
>> Government
>>
>>
>>
>> Saw this today: Department of Basic Education Bans Open Source
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> http://dkeats.com/index.php?action=3Dviewsingle&module=3Dblog&postid=3Dg=
en21Srv8Nme0_40332_1381256759&userid=3D7050120123
>>
>>
>>
>> And Delphi?!????!!
>>
>>
>>
>> Shocker.
>>
>> =97
>> Sent from Mailbox <https://www.dropbox.com/mailbox> for iPhone
>>
>>
>>
>> On Mon, Aug 5, 2013 at 4:19 PM, Adi Eyal <adi at burgercom.co.za> wrote:
>>
>> Hi Niki
>>
>> On 5 August 2013 16:05, Niki Moore <nikimoore007 at gmail.com> wrote:
>> > With reference to my previous reply.... I switched over to Linux a few
>> > months ago, and I am battling with it, it's not as easy as Microsoft a=
nd
>> > requires me to phone my support desk almost weekly to find out how to
>> > install programmes... and there are some of my appliances, like my
>> scanner,
>> > that do not support Linux. There is a scarcity of technical support fo=
r
>> > people who are not computer programmers who have gone onto Linux. I ha=
ve
>> > just been having a chat with such a chap, who was telling me that as
>> the use
>> > of OSS increases, so companies are forced to offer support, but unless
>> you
>> > have some basic programming knowledge, Linux is extremely frustrating.
>> Can
>> > you imagine your average civil servant handling the programming
>> required to
>> > open source?
>>
>> I feel your pain. Funnily enough, I just bought a laptop which came
>> with Windows 8. I battled for about an hour trying to figure it out
>> and gave up in disgust. However, you're right, Linux is somewhat
>> difficult for non-techies. Having said that, my sexagenarian motherin
>> in law has been using Ubuntu for about a year now. She doesn't even
>> know that she's using it. I'm not trying to sell Linux on the desktop.
>> For most people used to Windows, it is a difficult switch. I find
>> MacOS difficult too, but it's mostly because it is a new interface.
>> Linux though is not the only open source system around. There is lot's
>> of software that is opensource which runs on Windows.
>>
>> More importantly, bespoke software should be written as open source -
>> there is no reason why software which is built specifically for a
>> government department should be kept closed. Once built, it should be
>> shareable with other departments with no fee (except for installation
>> and support).
>>
>> One last thing - I didn't mention why I thought that the open data
>> groups were a good avenue for this initiative. Open data by itself is
>> a technical area which doesn't interest most people. If we pair open
>> data with open government or active citizenry, we have a much more
>> powerful tool to change society. This project is an example of how
>> that can happen. Collecting data from government departments is the
>> first piece of the puzzle.
>>
>> Adi
>> >
>> >
>> > On Mon, Aug 5, 2013 at 3:55 PM, Adi Eyal <adi at burgercom.co.za> wrote:
>> >>
>> >> They refuse to response to my PAIA requests. They have an open data
>> >> policy - they also administer Microsoft licences valuing over a
>> >> R100,000,000. I would like policy documents translated to real action=
.
>> >>
>> >> Adi
>> >>
>> >> On 5 August 2013 15:44, Niki Moore <nikimoore007 at gmail.com> wrote:
>> >> > Why don't you ask the SITA? They announced in their congress last
>> year
>> >> > that
>> >> > they are moving to open-source, so they should have an idea of the
>> spend
>> >> > of
>> >> > each department.
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > On Mon, Aug 5, 2013 at 3:16 PM, Adi Eyal <adi at burgercom.co.za>
>> wrote:
>> >> >>
>> >> >> Hi All
>> >> >>
>> >> >> I'm working on a personal project which these groups may find
>> >> >> interesting. I'd like to build a case for why moving government
>> >> >> departments to using open source software makes economic sense. I'=
m
>> >> >> doing this by laboriously contacting each government department an=
d
>> >> >> asking them what software they use and how much they pay for it.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> Yes I know - I may be a little idealistic and a touch naive, but I=
'm
>> >> >> not trying to argue the philosophical merits of why open source
>> >> >> software may be better than proprietary software.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> My logic is simply:
>> >> >>
>> >> >> If government spends Rx billion annually importing proprietary
>> >> >> software and they rather redirect that money to the local software
>> >> >> community for installation, customisation, support and hosting the=
n
>> we
>> >> >> can create Y new jobs.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> It's a lot of work but hopefully I can convince a few more people =
to
>> >> >> help me. I have data from 5 departments so far with a total annual
>> >> >> spend of over R26m.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> I would really appreciate your help. Collecting this information i=
s
>> >> >> time consuming. I plan to collect information across all spheres o=
f
>> >> >> government which you can imagine is a mammoth task. Any
>> contribution -
>> >> >> no matter how small would definitely ease the burden.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> If you want more information - have a look at this link:
>> >> >> https://github.com/adieyal/gov-software-audit
>> >> >>
>> >> >>
>> >> >> Just one caveat - this project is not about complaining about
>> >> >> Microsoft or snide comments about whether government is useless,
>> >> >> inefficient or incompetent. I am an idealist and I prefer a naivel=
y
>> >> >> optimistic approach. Even if the project fails (and the odds are
>> >> >> against it), I think it is a worthwhile cause and will add another
>> >> >> voice to why this is a good thing.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> Comments welcome.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> Adi
>> >> >>
>> >> >> --
>> >> >> Adi Eyal
>> >> >> Data Specialist
>> >> >> phone: +27 78 014 2469
>> >> >> skype: adieyalcas
>> >> >> linkedin: http://za.linkedin.com/pub/dir/Adi/Eyal
>> >> >>
>> >> >> --
>> >> >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
>> >> >> Groups
>> >> >> "HacksHackers CapeTown" group.
>> >> >> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it,
>> send
>> >> >> an
>> >> >> email to hackshackers-capetown+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com.
>> >> >> To post to this group, send an email to
>> >> >> hackshackers-capetown at googlegroups.com.
>> >> >> To view this discussion on the web, visit
>> >> >>
>> >> >>
>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/hackshackers-capetown/CAEQY0Y7dUmS2yTV=
QQ4uUH_%3DU4STfWQBSOkNgDF4SUhbVoBtVUQ%40mail.gmail.com
>> .
>> >> >>
>> >> >> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
>> >> >>
>> >> >>
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > --
>> >> > * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
>> >> > 7th Avenue Communications
>> >> > 031 - 205-8331
>> >> > 083 - 758-4483
>> >> >
>> >> > --
>> >> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
>> >> > Groups
>> >> > "HacksHackers CapeTown" group.
>> >> > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it,
>> send
>> >> > an
>> >> > email to hackshackers-capetown+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com.
>> >> > To post to this group, send an email to
>> >> > hackshackers-capetown at googlegroups.com.
>> >> > To view this discussion on the web, visit
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/hackshackers-capetown/CAE02g-MiaBcHkri=
Vxe2tengvLkTKOuojeyz69RavxybS0Km1DQ%40mail.gmail.com
>> .
>> >> >
>> >> > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> --
>> >> Adi Eyal
>> >> Data Specialist
>> >> phone: +27 78 014 2469
>> >> skype: adieyalcas
>> >> linkedin: http://za.linkedin.com/pub/dir/Adi/Eyal
>> >>
>> >> --
>> >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
>> Groups
>> >> "HacksHackers CapeTown" group.
>> >> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, sen=
d
>> an
>> >> email to hackshackers-capetown+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com.
>> >> To post to this group, send an email to
>> >> hackshackers-capetown at googlegroups.com.
>> >> To view this discussion on the web, visit
>> >>
>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/hackshackers-capetown/CAEQY0Y4Mkfd-9bH=
%3DytVxQNZUMRrn1YP%2B0Vqa-pXxrjveTUwqhw%40mail.gmail.com
>> .
>> >>
>> >> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > --
>> > * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
>> > 7th Avenue Communications
>> > 031 - 205-8331
>> > 083 - 758-4483
>> >
>> > --
>> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
>> Groups
>> > "HacksHackers CapeTown" group.
>> > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send
>> an
>> > email to hackshackers-capetown+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com.
>> > To post to this group, send an email to
>> > hackshackers-capetown at googlegroups.com.
>> > To view this discussion on the web, visit
>> >
>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/hackshackers-capetown/CAE02g-PLGgsFZq4=
BurZxVUG_0n2yjBmwdNd5OtmL%3DThsui%3DSkQ%40mail.gmail.com
>> .
>> >
>> > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
>> >
>> >
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Adi Eyal
>> Data Specialist
>> phone: +27 78 014 2469
>> skype: adieyalcas
>> linkedin: http://za.linkedin.com/pub/dir/Adi/Eyal
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> okfn-za mailing list
>> okfn-za at lists.okfn.org
>> http://lists.okfn.org/mailman/listinfo/okfn-za
>> Unsubscribe: http://lists.okfn.org/mailman/options/okfn-za
>>
>>
>>  _______________________________________________
>> okfn-za mailing list
>> okfn-za at lists.okfn.org
>> http://lists.okfn.org/mailman/listinfo/okfn-za
>> Unsubscribe: http://lists.okfn.org/mailman/options/okfn-za
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> okfn-za mailing list
>> okfn-za at lists.okfn.org
>> http://lists.okfn.org/mailman/listinfo/okfn-za
>> Unsubscribe: http://lists.okfn.org/mailman/options/okfn-za
>>
>>
>


--=20
<http://www.graphflow.com>
Robert Elliott | Co-founder
robert at graphflow.com | +27 71 882 4222 |
@greenafrican<http://twitter.com/greenafrican>

GraphFlow | Product, user and content recommendations
www.graphflow.com | @graphflow <http://twitter.com/graphflow>

--089e0117738f92ff1904e8731916
Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<div dir=3D"ltr"><div><div>I think &#39;crowdsourcing&#39; the data is an e=
xcellent idea. Interactions can be &#39;draft&#39; until officially confirm=
ed as and when evidence becomes available. Here is a D3 example of what we =
could end up with (albeit very conspiracy-theorist): <a href=3D"http://www.=
whodotheyserve.com/">http://www.whodotheyserve.com/</a><br>
<br></div>From a data perspective, what we need is:<br><ul><li>Entity (pers=
on or organisation)</li><li>Interaction (shareholder-in, partner-with, cont=
ract-with, employee-of, colleague-with, friend-of etc.)</li><ul><li>This sh=
ould include some sort of basis: link or document.<br>
</li></ul><li>Entity (person or organisation)</li></ul></div>So we would en=
d up with a interactions graph dataset. This could initially be a google sp=
read sheet or a simple db or wiki until it gets large enough to warrant a N=
oSQL graph db.<br>
</div><div class=3D"gmail_extra"><br><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Fri,=
 Oct 11, 2013 at 10:26 AM, Thoko Madonko <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"m=
ailto:thoko.madonko at gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">thoko.madonko at gmail.com</a=
>&gt;</span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1p=
x #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir=3D"ltr"><span></span>Dear All<span>=
</span><div><br></div><div>I am following the discussion with keen interest=
. Would there be a way to start small - I am thinking given the health refo=
rm taking place in SA - a 3d picture of who is connected to which medical s=
cheme would be a great start!=A0</div>


<div><br></div><div>Let me know if you are keen. I am sure I can find some =
cash monies to help do it.=A0</div><div><br></div><div>Thoko</div></div><di=
v class=3D"gmail_extra"><br clear=3D"all"><div><div style=3D"color:rgb(34,3=
4,34);font-size:13px;font-family:arial,sans-serif">


<b><span>__________________________________________</span></b></div><div st=
yle><img src=3D"https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-t95JVjwQ9CA/UA05IlbsDbI/=
AAAAAAAAAEM/VMgnqNjABOc/s314/buscard.jpg"><br>

</div><div style=3D"color:rgb(34,34,34);font-size:13px;font-family:arial,sa=
ns-serif"><b><span><span></span><span></span><br></span></b></div><span></s=
pan><span></span><span></span><span></span></div><div><div class=3D"h5">


<br><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On 10 October 2013 14:55, Greg Kempe <sp=
an dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:gregkempe at gmail.com" target=3D"_blank"=
>gregkempe at gmail.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_qu=
ote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex=
">


<div style=3D"word-wrap:break-word"><div style=3D"font-family:Helvetica,Ari=
al;font-size:13px;color:rgba(0,0,0,1.0);margin:0px;line-height:auto">Charle=
s, I agree, this would be very interesting. I&#39;ve also thought of doing =
something with the tender database.</div>


<div style=3D"font-family:Helvetica,Arial;font-size:13px;color:rgba(0,0,0,1=
.0);margin:0px;line-height:auto"><br></div><div style=3D"font-family:Helvet=
ica,Arial;font-size:13px;color:rgba(0,0,0,1.0);margin:0px;line-height:auto"=
>


But I think Adi is right: there&#39;s a lot of money to be made with that d=
ata, and a lot of incentive for people to keep it hidden. The journos would=
 love it, the business owners less so, so there&#39;d be some friction for =
sure.</div>


<span><font color=3D"#888888"> <div></div> <div><br></div></font></span><di=
v><span><font color=3D"#888888">Greg</font></span><div><div><br><p style=3D=
"color:#a0a0a8">On 10 October 2013 at 1:50:37 PM, Charles (<a href=3D"mailt=
o://chuckra@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">chuckra at gmail.com</a>) wrote:</p>


 <blockquote type=3D"cite" style=3D"border-left:1px #004080 solid!important=
;margin-left:0px;padding-left:5px"><span><div link=3D"blue" vlink=3D"purple=
" lang=3D"EN-GB"><div>














<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font color=3D"#1F497D" face=3D"Calibri"><span style=
=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;=
;color:#1f497d">
For me, the biggest hit we can make in open data in SA is the
companies office. If you look at what the <a href=3D"http://cat.open.org.nz=
/tag/companies/" target=3D"_blank">NZ govt</a>, for instance,
has done, we have a long way to go. But I dream of being able to
show a dynamic <a href=3D"http://d3js.org/" target=3D"_blank">D3</a> graph =
connecting
all our politicians to their family members and the companies in
which they are involved.</span></font></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font color=3D"#1F497D" face=3D"Calibri"><span style=
=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;=
;color:#1f497d">
=A0</span></font></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font color=3D"#1F497D" face=3D"Calibri"><span style=
=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;=
;color:#1f497d">
What are the chances of getting a nice REST service running at the
<a href=3D"http://www.cipc.co.za/" target=3D"_blank">CIPC</a>, where anyone=
 can query.
We=92d give journalists a field day=85</span></font></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font color=3D"#1F497D" face=3D"Calibri"><span style=
=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;=
;color:#1f497d">
=A0</span></font></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font color=3D"#1F497D" face=3D"Calibri"><span style=
=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;=
;color:#1f497d">
Charles</span></font></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font color=3D"#1F497D" face=3D"Calibri"><span style=
=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;=
;color:#1f497d">
=A0</span></font></p>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #b5c4df 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm =
0cm 0cm">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><b><font face=3D"Tahoma=
"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Tahoma&quot;,&quot;sans=
-serif&quot;;font-weight:bold" lang=3D"EN-US">From:</span></font></b> <font=
 face=3D"Tahoma"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Tahoma&q=
uot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;" lang=3D"EN-US"><a href=3D"mailto:okfn-za-bounc=
es at lists.okfn.org" target=3D"_blank">okfn-za-bounces at lists.okfn.org</a>
[mailto:<a href=3D"mailto:okfn-za-bounces at lists.okfn.org" target=3D"_blank"=
>okfn-za-bounces at lists.okfn.org</a>] <b><span style=3D"font-weight:bold">On=
 Behalf Of</span></b> Robert Elliott<br>
<b><span style=3D"font-weight:bold">Sent:</span></b> 09 October 2013
23:08<br>
<b><span style=3D"font-weight:bold">To:</span></b> <span>Adi</span> <span>E=
yal</span><br>
<b><span style=3D"font-weight:bold">Cc:</span></b>
<a href=3D"mailto:okfn-za at lists.okfn.org" target=3D"_blank">okfn-za at lists.o=
kfn.org</a>; <a href=3D"mailto:hackshackers-johannesburg at googlegroups.com" =
target=3D"_blank">hackshackers-johannesburg at googlegroups.com</a>;
<a href=3D"mailto:hackshackers-capetown at googlegroups.com" target=3D"_blank"=
>hackshackers-capetown at googlegroups.com</a>;
<a href=3D"mailto:odadi at googlegroups.com" target=3D"_blank">odadi at googlegro=
ups.com</a><br>
<b><span style=3D"font-weight:bold">Subject:</span></b> Re:
[<span>okfn-za</span>] [<span>HacksHackers</span> Cape Town] Open Source in
Government</span></font></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><font face=3D"Times New=
 Roman" size=3D"3"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt">=A0</span></font></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><font face=3D"Times New=
 Roman" size=3D"3"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt">Saw this
today: Department of Basic Education Bans Open
Source</span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><font face=3D"Times New=
 Roman" size=3D"3"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt">=A0</span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><font face=3D"Times New=
 Roman" size=3D"3"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt"><a href=3D"http://dkeat=
s.com/index.php?action=3Dviewsingle&amp;module=3Dblog&amp;postid=3Dgen21Srv=
8Nme0_40332_1381256759&amp;userid=3D7050120123" target=3D"_blank">
http://dkeats.com/index.php?action=3Dviewsingle&amp;module=3Dblog&amp;posti=
d=3Dgen21Srv8Nme0_40332_1381256759&amp;userid=3D7050120123</a></span></font=
></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><font face=3D"Times New=
 Roman" size=3D"3"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt">=A0</span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><font face=3D"Times New=
 Roman" size=3D"3"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt">And
Delphi?!????!!</span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><font face=3D"Times New=
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<div>
<p style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><font face=3D"Times New Roman" size=3D"3"><=
span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt">On Mon, Aug 5,
2013 at 4:19 PM, <span>Adi</span> <span>Eyal</span> &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:a=
di at burgercom.co.za" target=3D"_blank">adi at burgercom.co.za</a>&gt;
wrote:</span></font></p>
<blockquote style=3D"border:none;border-left:solid #cccccc 1.0pt;padding:0c=
m 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0cm">
<p style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><font face=3D"Times New Roman" size=3D"3"><=
span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt">Hi <span>Niki</span><br>
<br>
On 5 August 2013 16:05, <span>Niki</span> Moore
&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:nikimoore007 at gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">nikimoore00=
7 at gmail.com</a>&gt;
wrote:<br>
&gt; With reference to my previous reply.... I switched over to
Linux a few<br>
&gt; months ago, and I am battling with it, it&#39;s not as easy as
Microsoft and<br>
&gt; requires me to phone my support desk almost weekly to find out
how to<br>
&gt; install programmes... and there are some of my appliances,
like my scanner,<br>
&gt; that do not support Linux. There is a scarcity of technical
support for<br>
&gt; people who are not computer programmers who have gone onto
Linux. I have<br>
&gt; just been having a chat with such a chap, who was telling me
that as the use<br>
&gt; of OSS increases, so companies are forced to offer support,
but unless you<br>
&gt; have some basic programming knowledge, Linux is extremely
frustrating. Can<br>
&gt; you imagine your average civil servant handling the
programming required to<br>
&gt; open source?<br>
<br>
I feel your pain. Funnily enough, I just bought a laptop which
came<br>
with Windows 8. I battled for about an hour trying to figure it
out<br>
and gave up in disgust. However, you&#39;re right, Linux is
somewhat<br>
difficult for non-techies. Having said that, my sexagenarian
<span>motherin</span><br>
in law has been using <span>Ubuntu</span> for about
a year now. She doesn&#39;t even<br>
know that she&#39;s using it. I&#39;m not trying to sell Linux on the
desktop.<br>
For most people used to Windows, it is a difficult switch. I
find<br>
<span>MacOS</span> difficult too, but it&#39;s mostly
because it is a new interface.<br>
Linux though is not the only open source system around. There is
<span>lot&#39;s</span><br>
of software that is <span>opensource</span> which
runs on Windows.<br>
<br>
More importantly, bespoke software should be written as open source
-<br>
there is no reason why software which is built specifically for
a<br>
government department should be kept closed. Once built, it should
be<br>
shareable with other departments with no fee (except for
installation<br>
and support).<br>
<br>
One last thing - I didn&#39;t mention why I thought that the open
data<br>
groups were a good avenue for this initiative. Open data by itself
is<br>
a technical area which doesn&#39;t interest most people. If we pair
open<br>
data with open government or active citizenry, we have a much
more<br>
powerful tool to change society. This project is an example of
how<br>
that can happen. Collecting data from government departments is
the<br>
first piece of the puzzle.<br>
<br>
<span>Adi</span><br>
&gt;<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; On Mon, Aug 5, 2013 at 3:55 PM, <span>Adi</span> <span>Eyal</span> &lt=
;<a href=3D"mailto:adi at burgercom.co.za" target=3D"_blank">adi at burgercom.co.=
za</a>&gt;
wrote:<br>
&gt;&gt;<br>
&gt;&gt; They refuse to response to my PAIA requests. They have an
open data<br>
&gt;&gt; policy - they also administer Microsoft licences valuing
over a<br>
&gt;&gt; R100,000,000. I would like policy documents translated to
real action.<br>
&gt;&gt;<br>
&gt;&gt; <span>Adi</span><br>
&gt;&gt;<br>
&gt;&gt; On 5 August 2013 15:44, <span>Niki</span>
Moore &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:nikimoore007 at gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">nikim=
oore007 at gmail.com</a>&gt;
wrote:<br>
&gt;&gt; &gt; Why don&#39;t you ask the SITA? They announced in their
congress last year<br>
&gt;&gt; &gt; that<br>
&gt;&gt; &gt; they are moving to open-source, so they should have
an idea of the spend<br>
&gt;&gt; &gt; of<br>
&gt;&gt; &gt; each department.<br>
&gt;&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt;&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt;&gt; &gt; On Mon, Aug 5, 2013 at 3:16 PM, <span>Adi</span> <span>Eyal</=
span> &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:adi at burgercom.co.za" target=3D"_blank">adi at burg=
ercom.co.za</a>&gt;
wrote:<br>
&gt;&gt; &gt;&gt;<br>
&gt;&gt; &gt;&gt; Hi All<br>
&gt;&gt; &gt;&gt;<br>
&gt;&gt; &gt;&gt; I&#39;m working on a personal project which these
groups may find<br>
&gt;&gt; &gt;&gt; interesting. I&#39;d like to build a case for why
moving government<br>
&gt;&gt; &gt;&gt; departments to using open source software makes
economic sense. I&#39;m<br>
&gt;&gt; &gt;&gt; doing this by laboriously contacting each
government department and<br>
&gt;&gt; &gt;&gt; asking them what software they use and how much
they pay for it.<br>
&gt;&gt; &gt;&gt;<br>
&gt;&gt; &gt;&gt; Yes I know - I may be a little idealistic and a
touch naive, but I&#39;m<br>
&gt;&gt; &gt;&gt; not trying to argue the philosophical merits of
why open source<br>
&gt;&gt; &gt;&gt; software may be better than proprietary
software.<br>
&gt;&gt; &gt;&gt;<br>
&gt;&gt; &gt;&gt; My logic is simply:<br>
&gt;&gt; &gt;&gt;<br>
&gt;&gt; &gt;&gt; If government spends Rx billion annually
importing proprietary<br>
&gt;&gt; &gt;&gt; software and they rather redirect that money to
the local software<br>
&gt;&gt; &gt;&gt; community for installation, customisation,
support and hosting then we<br>
&gt;&gt; &gt;&gt; can create Y new jobs.<br>
&gt;&gt; &gt;&gt;<br>
&gt;&gt; &gt;&gt; It&#39;s a lot of work but hopefully I can convince a
few more people to<br>
&gt;&gt; &gt;&gt; help me. I have data from 5 departments so far
with a total annual<br>
&gt;&gt; &gt;&gt; spend of over R26m.<br>
&gt;&gt; &gt;&gt;<br>
&gt;&gt; &gt;&gt; I would really appreciate your help. Collecting
this information is<br>
&gt;&gt; &gt;&gt; time consuming. I plan to collect information
across all spheres of<br>
&gt;&gt; &gt;&gt; government which you can imagine is a mammoth
task. Any contribution -<br>
&gt;&gt; &gt;&gt; no matter how small would definitely ease the
burden.<br>
&gt;&gt; &gt;&gt;<br>
&gt;&gt; &gt;&gt; If you want more information - have a look at
this link:<br>
&gt;&gt; &gt;&gt; <a href=3D"https://github.com/adieyal/gov-software-audit"=
 target=3D"_blank">https://github.com/adieyal/gov-software-audit</a><br>

&gt;&gt; &gt;&gt;<br>
&gt;&gt; &gt;&gt;<br>
&gt;&gt; &gt;&gt; Just one caveat - this project is not about
complaining about<br>
&gt;&gt; &gt;&gt; Microsoft or snide comments about whether
government is useless,<br>
&gt;&gt; &gt;&gt; inefficient or incompetent. I am an idealist and
I prefer a naively<br>
&gt;&gt; &gt;&gt; optimistic approach. Even if the project fails
(and the odds are<br>
&gt;&gt; &gt;&gt; against it), I think it is a worthwhile cause and
will add another<br>
&gt;&gt; &gt;&gt; voice to why this is a good thing.<br>
&gt;&gt; &gt;&gt;<br>
&gt;&gt; &gt;&gt; Comments welcome.<br>
&gt;&gt; &gt;&gt;<br>
&gt;&gt; &gt;&gt; <span>Adi</span><br>
&gt;&gt; &gt;&gt;<br>
&gt;&gt; &gt;&gt; --<br>
&gt;&gt; &gt;&gt; <span>Adi</span> <span>Eyal</span><br>
&gt;&gt; &gt;&gt; Data Specialist<br>
&gt;&gt; &gt;&gt; phone: <a href=3D"tel:%2B27%2078%20014%202469" value=3D"+=
27780142469" target=3D"_blank">+27 78 014 2469</a><br>
&gt;&gt; &gt;&gt; <span>skype</span>: <span>adieyalcas</span><br>
&gt;&gt; &gt;&gt; <span>linkedin</span>: <a href=3D"http://za.linkedin.com/=
pub/dir/Adi/Eyal" target=3D"_blank">http://za.linkedin.com/pub/dir/Adi/Eyal=
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&gt;&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt;&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt;&gt;<br>
&gt;&gt;<br>
&gt;&gt;<br>
&gt;&gt; --<br>
&gt;&gt; <span>Adi</span> <span>Eyal</span><br>
&gt;&gt; Data Specialist<br>
&gt;&gt; phone: <a href=3D"tel:%2B27%2078%20014%202469" value=3D"+277801424=
69" target=3D"_blank">+27 78 014 2469</a><br>
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&gt;<br>
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<br>
<br>
<br>
--<br>
<span>Adi</span> <span>Eyal</span><br>
Data Specialist<br>
phone: <a href=3D"tel:%2B27%2078%20014%202469" value=3D"+27780142469" targe=
t=3D"_blank">+27 78 014 2469</a><br>
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</blockquote></div><br><br clear=3D"all"><br>-- <br><div dir=3D"ltr"><div><=
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